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The New Coffee Room

  1. TNCR
  2. General Discussion
  3. By the mile

By the mile

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved General Discussion
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  • MikM Mik

    But Ax has a legitimate point. If gas taxes pretty much disappear, how do we fund the interstate and US highways?

    RenaudaR Offline
    RenaudaR Offline
    Renauda
    wrote on last edited by
    #32

    @mik said in By the mile:

    But Ax has a legitimate point. If gas taxes pretty much disappear, how do we fund the interstate and US highways?

    Here's a start. Vehicles regardless of how they are fueled require tires. A road tax on tires at point of sale.

    Elbows up!

    L 1 Reply Last reply
    • RenaudaR Renauda

      @mik said in By the mile:

      But Ax has a legitimate point. If gas taxes pretty much disappear, how do we fund the interstate and US highways?

      Here's a start. Vehicles regardless of how they are fueled require tires. A road tax on tires at point of sale.

      L Offline
      L Offline
      Loki
      wrote on last edited by Loki
      #33

      @renauda said in By the mile:

      @mik said in By the mile:

      But Ax has a legitimate point. If gas taxes pretty much disappear, how do we fund the interstate and US highways?

      Here's a start. Vehicles regardless of how they are fueled require tires. A road tax on tires at point of sale.

      Bald tires more accidents and deaths? People hate taxes, it’s always the other guy who “should” pay.

      RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
      • L Loki

        @renauda said in By the mile:

        @mik said in By the mile:

        But Ax has a legitimate point. If gas taxes pretty much disappear, how do we fund the interstate and US highways?

        Here's a start. Vehicles regardless of how they are fueled require tires. A road tax on tires at point of sale.

        Bald tires more accidents and deaths? People hate taxes, it’s always the other guy who “should” pay.

        RenaudaR Offline
        RenaudaR Offline
        Renauda
        wrote on last edited by
        #34

        @loki

        Then take public transit.

        Elbows up!

        LuFins DadL 1 Reply Last reply
        • LuFins DadL Offline
          LuFins DadL Offline
          LuFins Dad
          wrote on last edited by
          #35

          It’s still regressive. The gas tax, tire taxes, all hit the poor and lower middle class disproportionately harder than the upper middle class and the wealthy, especially post covid.

          The Brad

          RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
          • RenaudaR Renauda

            @loki

            Then take public transit.

            LuFins DadL Offline
            LuFins DadL Offline
            LuFins Dad
            wrote on last edited by
            #36

            @renauda said in By the mile:

            @loki

            Then take public transit.

            Good luck finding any kind of decent public transit in Perryopolis, Pennsylvania.

            The Brad

            Aqua LetiferA 1 Reply Last reply
            • LuFins DadL LuFins Dad

              @renauda said in By the mile:

              @loki

              Then take public transit.

              Good luck finding any kind of decent public transit in Perryopolis, Pennsylvania.

              Aqua LetiferA Offline
              Aqua LetiferA Offline
              Aqua Letifer
              wrote on last edited by
              #37

              @lufins-dad said in By the mile:

              @renauda said in By the mile:

              @loki

              Then take public transit.

              Good luck finding any kind of decent public transit in Perryopolis, Pennsylvania.

              What are you talking about? Dwayne will drive you anywhere you need to go, you just need to give him about a week's heads up. You need his landline number?

              Please love yourself.

              1 Reply Last reply
              • LuFins DadL LuFins Dad

                It’s still regressive. The gas tax, tire taxes, all hit the poor and lower middle class disproportionately harder than the upper middle class and the wealthy, especially post covid.

                RenaudaR Offline
                RenaudaR Offline
                Renauda
                wrote on last edited by Renauda
                #38

                @lufins-dad said in By the mile:

                It’s still regressive. The gas tax, tire taxes, all hit the poor and lower middle class disproportionately harder than the upper middle class and the wealthy, especially post covid.

                Am fully aware of that, however there is a cost to public infrastructure and its maintenance. The money has to come from somewhere and that somewhere is taxpayers, citizens and industry alike. Either through income taxes, levies or consumption taxes.

                The US has a great Interstate Highway system. It is worth the tax dollar investment to maintain and expand. Likewise I am sure there are also state and municipal roadways that are also worth the public investment as well.

                Elbows up!

                LuFins DadL 1 Reply Last reply
                • MikM Offline
                  MikM Offline
                  Mik
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #39

                  Yep. Roads are damned convenient.

                  “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  • RenaudaR Renauda

                    @lufins-dad said in By the mile:

                    It’s still regressive. The gas tax, tire taxes, all hit the poor and lower middle class disproportionately harder than the upper middle class and the wealthy, especially post covid.

                    Am fully aware of that, however there is a cost to public infrastructure and its maintenance. The money has to come from somewhere and that somewhere is taxpayers, citizens and industry alike. Either through income taxes, levies or consumption taxes.

                    The US has a great Interstate Highway system. It is worth the tax dollar investment to maintain and expand. Likewise I am sure there are also state and municipal roadways that are also worth the public investment as well.

                    LuFins DadL Offline
                    LuFins DadL Offline
                    LuFins Dad
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #40

                    @renauda No doubt. As I posted earlier, infrastructure and roadways are absolutely one of the fundamental responsibilities of the Federal Government, and yes, they have to be paid for. I am also a big believer in consumption taxes, in general, but you can't value the impact of roads by miles driven. It just doesn't work. You want to use a consumption tax to pay for it? Ok, how about a .25% sales tax on every item or service provided in the United States? That's going to be more equitable than basing it off of miles driven. That would generate roughly $200 billion a year. The current transportation budget is $72 billion. I think nearly tripling would be enough to start some of these projects, and for the median income consumer, it would make a difference of $50 out of pocket over the course of the year.

                    The Brad

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • RenaudaR Offline
                      RenaudaR Offline
                      Renauda
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #41

                      Why a Federal responsibility? Should public roadways not be shared by Federal and State governments? What about municipal roadways - some should be exclusively municipal others in partnership with state and possibly even federal funding grants.

                      Elbows up!

                      LuFins DadL 1 Reply Last reply
                      • RenaudaR Renauda

                        Why a Federal responsibility? Should public roadways not be shared by Federal and State governments? What about municipal roadways - some should be exclusively municipal others in partnership with state and possibly even federal funding grants.

                        LuFins DadL Offline
                        LuFins DadL Offline
                        LuFins Dad
                        wrote on last edited by LuFins Dad
                        #42

                        @renauda said in By the mile:

                        Why a Federal responsibility? Should public roadways not be shared by Federal and State governments? What about municipal roadways - some should be exclusively municipal others in partnership with state and possibly even federal funding grants.

                        I'm not getting your question? Intrastate roadways already are and should be the responsibility of local and state authorities, interstate roadways are the responsibility of the federal government. I have no expectations of Uncle Sam paving the road in front of my house, but I do fully expect him to take care of 95. In a lot of cases, they will still use local crews... VDOT (Virginia Department of Transportation) will handle all of the work on 95 throughout VA, but the costs are covered by the FHWA.

                        Beyond that, building and maintaining roadways is a necessary part of the delegated powers given to the federal government: to regulate commerce, to declare war, to raise and maintain armed forces, and to establish a post office. These responsibilities are specifically laid out in the Constitution.

                        The Brad

                        RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
                        • MikM Offline
                          MikM Offline
                          Mik
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #43

                          The federal also supports the US highways, the interstate predecessors. I like traveling them because you see a lot more and they generally have a lot less traffic. Might be a little slower but that never bothered me.

                          “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

                          LuFins DadL 1 Reply Last reply
                          • MikM Mik

                            The federal also supports the US highways, the interstate predecessors. I like traveling them because you see a lot more and they generally have a lot less traffic. Might be a little slower but that never bothered me.

                            LuFins DadL Offline
                            LuFins DadL Offline
                            LuFins Dad
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #44

                            @mik said in By the mile:

                            The federal also supports the US highways, the interstate predecessors. I like traveling them because you see a lot more and they generally have a lot less traffic. Might be a little slower but that never bothered me.

                            If the road sign is shaped like a shield, then it's a Federal highway.

                            alt text

                            alt text

                            Otherwise, it's local.

                            The Brad

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            • LuFins DadL LuFins Dad

                              @renauda said in By the mile:

                              Why a Federal responsibility? Should public roadways not be shared by Federal and State governments? What about municipal roadways - some should be exclusively municipal others in partnership with state and possibly even federal funding grants.

                              I'm not getting your question? Intrastate roadways already are and should be the responsibility of local and state authorities, interstate roadways are the responsibility of the federal government. I have no expectations of Uncle Sam paving the road in front of my house, but I do fully expect him to take care of 95. In a lot of cases, they will still use local crews... VDOT (Virginia Department of Transportation) will handle all of the work on 95 throughout VA, but the costs are covered by the FHWA.

                              Beyond that, building and maintaining roadways is a necessary part of the delegated powers given to the federal government: to regulate commerce, to declare war, to raise and maintain armed forces, and to establish a post office. These responsibilities are specifically laid out in the Constitution.

                              RenaudaR Offline
                              RenaudaR Offline
                              Renauda
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #45

                              @lufins-dad said in By the mile:

                              I'm not getting your question? Intrastate roadways already are and should be the responsibility of local and state authorities, interstate roadways are the responsibility of the federal government.

                              And I don't the know the details of US federalism. Here the interprovincial highways are built jointly between the federal and provincial governments then maintained by the provincial governments in part through, federal grants. The only highways that are exclusively federal are those traversing through national parks and treaty Indian Reservations.

                              Elbows up!

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              • MikM Offline
                                MikM Offline
                                Mik
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #46

                                Pretty much the same here as far as i know. The states bear some of the cost. .

                                “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                • RenaudaR Offline
                                  RenaudaR Offline
                                  Renauda
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #47

                                  As it should be.

                                  Elbows up!

                                  1 Reply Last reply
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