Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.
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wrote on 18 Sept 2020, 14:18 last edited by
I think that national health care does have a place.
Not sure exactly about Medicare for all, but I think Jolly is right. There would be cost shifting. Private insurers and employees would pay less, while others would pay more.
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wrote on 18 Sept 2020, 14:33 last edited by
There are no “others”.
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Cost-shifting.
If Americans suddenly started looking at $400/month Medicare bills, they would understand.
Medicare for all, is a bankrupting pipe dream.
wrote on 18 Sept 2020, 14:39 last edited by@Jolly said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
Cost-shifting.
If Americans suddenly started looking at $400/month Medicare bills, they would understand.
Then let “them” see the bills, let “them” understand.
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@Jolly said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
Cost-shifting.
If Americans suddenly started looking at $400/month Medicare bills, they would understand.
Then let “them” see the bills, let “them” understand.
wrote on 18 Sept 2020, 18:46 last edited by@Axtremus said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
@Jolly said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
Cost-shifting.
If Americans suddenly started looking at $400/month Medicare bills, they would understand.
Then let “them” see the bills, let “them” understand.
You don't have a clue, do you?
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@Axtremus said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
@Jolly said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
Cost-shifting.
If Americans suddenly started looking at $400/month Medicare bills, they would understand.
Then let “them” see the bills, let “them” understand.
You don't have a clue, do you?
wrote on 19 Sept 2020, 00:31 last edited by@Jolly said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
@Axtremus said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
@Jolly said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
Cost-shifting.
If Americans suddenly started looking at $400/month Medicare bills, they would understand.
Then let “them” see the bills, let “them” understand.
You don't have a clue, do you?
I actually dont (and I mean that in a serious way). Isn't it kind of "zero sum"?
If there is national health care, the argument against it is that administration costs will go up? What else would go up?
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@Jolly said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
@Axtremus said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
@Jolly said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
Cost-shifting.
If Americans suddenly started looking at $400/month Medicare bills, they would understand.
Then let “them” see the bills, let “them” understand.
You don't have a clue, do you?
I actually dont (and I mean that in a serious way). Isn't it kind of "zero sum"?
If there is national health care, the argument against it is that administration costs will go up? What else would go up?
wrote on 19 Sept 2020, 00:48 last edited by@taiwan_girl said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
@Jolly said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
@Axtremus said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
@Jolly said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
Cost-shifting.
If Americans suddenly started looking at $400/month Medicare bills, they would understand.
Then let “them” see the bills, let “them” understand.
You don't have a clue, do you?
I actually dont (and I mean that in a serious way). Isn't it kind of "zero sum"?
If there is national health care, the argument against it is that administration costs will go up? What else would go up?
Ok...About 68 million people have Medicare or Medicaid at a cost of approximately $1.2T (that's trillion, folks). So, if we cover 330,000,000 people...Well, you do the math...Granted, older people generate higher use, thus more costs.
My best guess would be $4T/year. That's roughly equal to the U.S. Budget of 2019. The whole budget.
I'll tell you what else would go up...doctor bills. Current Medicare reimbursement will not pay enough to keep most docs in business.
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@taiwan_girl said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
@Jolly said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
@Axtremus said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
@Jolly said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
Cost-shifting.
If Americans suddenly started looking at $400/month Medicare bills, they would understand.
Then let “them” see the bills, let “them” understand.
You don't have a clue, do you?
I actually dont (and I mean that in a serious way). Isn't it kind of "zero sum"?
If there is national health care, the argument against it is that administration costs will go up? What else would go up?
Ok...About 68 million people have Medicare or Medicaid at a cost of approximately $1.2T (that's trillion, folks). So, if we cover 330,000,000 people...Well, you do the math...Granted, older people generate higher use, thus more costs.
My best guess would be $4T/year. That's roughly equal to the U.S. Budget of 2019. The whole budget.
I'll tell you what else would go up...doctor bills. Current Medicare reimbursement will not pay enough to keep most docs in business.
wrote on 19 Sept 2020, 01:23 last edited by@Jolly said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
@taiwan_girl said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
@Jolly said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
@Axtremus said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
@Jolly said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
Cost-shifting.
If Americans suddenly started looking at $400/month Medicare bills, they would understand.
Then let “them” see the bills, let “them” understand.
You don't have a clue, do you?
I actually dont (and I mean that in a serious way). Isn't it kind of "zero sum"?
If there is national health care, the argument against it is that administration costs will go up? What else would go up?
Ok...About 68 million people have Medicare or Medicaid at a cost of approximately $1.2T (that's trillion, folks). So, if we cover 330,000,000 people...Well, you do the math...Granted, older people generate higher use, thus more costs.
My best guess would be $4T/year. That's roughly equal to the U.S. Budget of 2019. The whole budget.
But, you cannot assume that people will not be paying for insurance. In Taiwan, there is a "national health insurance", but everybody still pays for it. Money is taken out of paychecks, employers contribute, etc.
Average US family cost for insurance is >$20,000USD. Multiply that by 85 MM families and that is almost USD $2 trillion.
I do not think that any national health insurance means that nobody pays for anything.
I'll tell you what else would go up...doctor bills. Current Medicare reimbursement will not pay enough to keep most docs in business.
That is something else I dont understand about the US health system. SE Asian is getting very big in "medical tourism". For example, a hip replacement in the US is maybe $30-40000 USD, while in Thailand it will be USD$8-12000, with no loss in quality. Where is that 3-4x higher cost due to? Admin? Salary? Inefficiency? Regulations? Better quality control? Insurance costs? All of the above?
I know some US insurance companies will encourage people to go to Thailand for pre-plan surgery. They can fly someone over, put them up in a 5* hotel, have the surgery and fly home, and still cost the insurance company less money.
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wrote on 19 Sept 2020, 01:34 last edited by
I'm talking cost. $4T. That's a hard number, by more than one hard review of Sender's plan.
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wrote on 19 Sept 2020, 01:43 last edited by
@Jolly said in Employers and private insurance pay 247% of Medicare per Rand Corp.:
I'm talking cost. $4T. That's a hard number, by more than one hard review of Sender's plan.
Is this number higher (and by how much) than the total insurance premiums + out of pocket payments that are paid by people.
As said above
Medicare = $1.2 trillion
Family Premium cost = $2 Trillion
Individuals not on family insurance = $?? (alot)
Out of pocket cost = $?? (alot I am sure)Total = $??
Maybe the above is too simple a way to look at it. I am not saying you are incorrect that a national health insurance will be a lot higher. I am just curious as to how much higher and more important, WHY?
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wrote on 19 Sept 2020, 01:56 last edited by
It will just add a layer of cost, nothing will go away.
The national insurance will be terrible so we, who can afford it, will still purchase supplemental insurance. Just like now.
The question is why bother?
Everyone who wants insurance now has it.