Manchin: "Nope on Harris."
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wrote on 24 Sept 2024, 21:04 last edited by
https://www.cnn.com/2024/09/24/politics/joe-manchin-not-endorse-harris-filibuster/index.html
Vice President Kamala Harris’ vow to gut the Senate’s filibuster rule to pass a bill codifying abortion rights has cost her an endorsement from a leading Senate moderate: Joe Manchin.
The West Virginia independent, one of the staunchest defenders of the potent delay tactic in the Senate, told CNN on Tuesday that he wouldn’t back her candidacy now — despite signaling earlier this month he was getting ready to do so.
“Shame on her,” Manchin, who is retiring at year’s end, said in the Capitol. “She knows the filibuster is the Holy Grail of democracy. It’s the only thing that keeps us talking and working together. If she gets rid of that, then this would be the House on steroids.”
Now that Harris has vowed to gut the filibuster on this issue, Manchin said he wouldn’t back her for president.
“That ain’t going to happen,” he said. “I think that basically can destroy our country, and my country is more important to me than any one person or any one person’s ideology. … I think it’s the most horrible thing.”
Manchin, a former Democrat who registered as an independent earlier this year, said he still hasn’t spoken to Harris despite his attempts to do so.
Asked about Harris’ past support for gutting the filibuster, Manchin said: “Well, she said she supported banning fracking too, and she changed that. I was hoping she would change this.”
Manchin’s comments come in the wake of Harris telling Wisconsin Public Radio this week, “We should eliminate the filibuster for Roe.”
Because killing the filibuster has worked out so well for Democrats in the past, I see no reason to not do it again.
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wrote on 25 Sept 2024, 00:34 last edited by
Sen. Manchin is right.
VP Harris is absolutely wrong on this.
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Sen. Manchin is right.
VP Harris is absolutely wrong on this.
wrote on 25 Sept 2024, 00:56 last edited by@taiwan_girl said in Manchin: "Nope on Harris.":
VP Harris is absolutely wrong on this.
Get rid of the filibuster and watch how laws change every four years.
By the way, considering how well the abolition of the filibuster worked for the Democrats since Harry Reid, why hasn't the Democrat-controlled Senate voted to change the rules? So-called "Independents" caucus and almost always vote with the Democrats, giving the Dems a majority of votes for rule change.
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wrote on 25 Sept 2024, 01:00 last edited by
Tell me again who is saving democracy.
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wrote on 25 Sept 2024, 01:28 last edited by
You can say lots of things about the filibuster, but ‘holy grail of democracy’ isn’t one of them.
Most democracies have nothing of the sort.
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wrote on 25 Sept 2024, 01:31 last edited by
@Mik said in Manchin: "Nope on Harris.":
Tell me again who is saving democracy.
The origin of the term "tyranny of the majority" is commonly attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville, who used it in his book Democracy in America. It appears in Part 2 of the book in the title of Chapter 8, "What Moderates the Tyranny of the Majority in the United States' Absence of Administrative Centralization" (French: De ce qui tempère aux États-Unis la tyrannie de la majorité[5]) and in the previous chapter in the names of sections such as "The Tyranny of the Majority" and "Effects of the Tyranny of the Majority on American National Character; the Courtier Spirit in the United States".
If the Democrats win 2 states and DC by 75-25 margins, they win the national popular vote. They are the majority.
Should the other 48 states be ignored?
For context. In 2020.
New York - Biden won 61% of the popular vote.
California - Biden won 63% of the popular vote.
DC - Biden won 92% of the popular vote. -
@Mik said in Manchin: "Nope on Harris.":
Tell me again who is saving democracy.
The origin of the term "tyranny of the majority" is commonly attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville, who used it in his book Democracy in America. It appears in Part 2 of the book in the title of Chapter 8, "What Moderates the Tyranny of the Majority in the United States' Absence of Administrative Centralization" (French: De ce qui tempère aux États-Unis la tyrannie de la majorité[5]) and in the previous chapter in the names of sections such as "The Tyranny of the Majority" and "Effects of the Tyranny of the Majority on American National Character; the Courtier Spirit in the United States".
If the Democrats win 2 states and DC by 75-25 margins, they win the national popular vote. They are the majority.
Should the other 48 states be ignored?
For context. In 2020.
New York - Biden won 61% of the popular vote.
California - Biden won 63% of the popular vote.
DC - Biden won 92% of the popular vote.wrote on 25 Sept 2024, 01:36 last edited by@George-K said in Manchin: "Nope on Harris.":
If the Democrats win 2 states and DC by 75-25 margins, they win the national popular vote. They are the majority.
Complete bullshit those numbers don’t pan out at all.
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@George-K said in Manchin: "Nope on Harris.":
If the Democrats win 2 states and DC by 75-25 margins, they win the national popular vote. They are the majority.
Complete bullshit those numbers don’t pan out at all.
wrote on 25 Sept 2024, 02:10 last edited by@jon-nyc said in Manchin: "Nope on Harris.":
Complete bullshit those numbers don’t pan out at all.
You're right. It's off by a factor of about 2.
If you use those numbers, the total votes in NY, CA and DC total about 74mm. The balance is 149mm if you look at only registered voters.
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@jon-nyc said in Manchin: "Nope on Harris.":
Complete bullshit those numbers don’t pan out at all.
You're right. It's off by a factor of about 2.
If you use those numbers, the total votes in NY, CA and DC total about 74mm. The balance is 149mm if you look at only registered voters.
wrote on 25 Sept 2024, 02:28 last edited by@George-K said in Manchin: "Nope on Harris.":
@jon-nyc said in Manchin: "Nope on Harris.":
Complete bullshit those numbers don’t pan out at all.
You're right. It's off by a factor of about 2.
If you use those numbers, the total votes in NY, CA and DC total about 74mm.
That’s more like the total population of the three. RVs? LVs? Much less
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wrote on 25 Sept 2024, 02:34 last edited by jon-nyc
Total votes in 2020 from NY, DC, and CA were 26MM.
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wrote on 25 Sept 2024, 10:38 last edited by
George, weren't you the one who said that the British electoral system was really confusing?
It's a shit-load easier to understand than all this stuff with colleges and what-not.
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wrote on 25 Sept 2024, 10:53 last edited by George K
@jon-nyc said in Manchin: "Nope on Harris.":
Total votes in 2020 from NY, DC, and CA were 26MM.
My bad - in my calcs, I looked at 75% of registered voters, not the actual number who voted.
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wrote on 25 Sept 2024, 10:54 last edited by
But...back to "My values have not changed" Harris:
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@George-K said in Manchin: "Nope on Harris.":
If the Democrats win 2 states and DC by 75-25 margins, they win the national popular vote. They are the majority.
Complete bullshit those numbers don’t pan out at all.
wrote on 25 Sept 2024, 12:01 last edited by George K@jon-nyc said in Manchin: "Nope on Harris.":
@George-K said in Manchin: "Nope on Harris.":
If the Democrats win 2 states and DC by 75-25 margins, they win the national popular vote. They are the majority.
Complete bullshit those numbers don’t pan out at all.
Total votes in CA, NY, DC - 25,949,949
75% Dem - 19,462,462
25% GOP - 6.487.487Total votes rest of country - 129,557,510
46% Dem - 59,596,455
56% GOP - 69,961,055Grand Total:
Dem: 79,058,916
GOP: 76,448,543Dems win popular vote by 2.5 million in his hypothetical.
ETA: And lose the electoral college.
ETA again: that post is from May 2019, and he used 2016 data.
