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The New Coffee Room

  1. TNCR
  2. General Discussion
  3. Should we take another hard look?

Should we take another hard look?

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  • George KG Offline
    George KG Offline
    George K
    wrote on last edited by
    #3

    This is the kind of bullshit that really pisses me off:

    This will kill you!” Fox News Channel’s Neil Cavuto exclaimed. “The president of the United States just acknowledged that he is taking hydroxychloroquine, a drug that [was] meant really to treat malaria and lupus.”

    Mrs. George (as I posted earlier this week) was given Plaquenil (the trade name) for her arthritis. At least let your rant be based on complete information, Mr. Cavuto.

    "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

    The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

    1 Reply Last reply
    • Aqua LetiferA Offline
      Aqua LetiferA Offline
      Aqua Letifer
      wrote on last edited by
      #4

      When we politicize science that heavily, we're done for. What's next, pro/con covid vaccine along political lines?

      Please love yourself.

      jon-nycJ 1 Reply Last reply
      • CopperC Offline
        CopperC Offline
        Copper
        wrote on last edited by
        #5

        If Mr. Trump is first in line to receive the vaccine, it will be reckless and evil.

        If Mr. Obama is first in line to receive the vaccine, it will be the sensible, inclusive thing to do.

        JollyJ 1 Reply Last reply
        • CopperC Copper

          If Mr. Trump is first in line to receive the vaccine, it will be reckless and evil.

          If Mr. Obama is first in line to receive the vaccine, it will be the sensible, inclusive thing to do.

          JollyJ Offline
          JollyJ Offline
          Jolly
          wrote on last edited by
          #6

          @Copper said in Should we take another hard look?:

          If Mr. Trump is first in line to receive the vaccine, it will be reckless and evil.

          If Mr. Obama is first in line to receive the vaccine, it will be the sensible, inclusive thing to do.

          At least according to the MSM.

          “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

          Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

          1 Reply Last reply
          • Aqua LetiferA Aqua Letifer

            When we politicize science that heavily, we're done for. What's next, pro/con covid vaccine along political lines?

            jon-nycJ Offline
            jon-nycJ Offline
            jon-nyc
            wrote on last edited by jon-nyc
            #7

            @Aqua-Letifer said in Should we take another hard look?:

            When we politicize science that heavily, we're done for. What's next, pro/con covid vaccine along political lines?

            I can almost see it happening, because Trump will likely be pushing for pre-election approval of the mRNA vaccine, which will cause the (not entirely unjustified) counter reaction about it being a brand new untested technology etc.

            What that scenario has going against it is that Trumpists seem to make up a good chunk of the 50% who say they won’t take a Covid vaccine at all.

            Only non-witches get due process.

            • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
            JollyJ 1 Reply Last reply
            • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

              @Aqua-Letifer said in Should we take another hard look?:

              When we politicize science that heavily, we're done for. What's next, pro/con covid vaccine along political lines?

              I can almost see it happening, because Trump will likely be pushing for pre-election approval of the mRNA vaccine, which will cause the (not entirely unjustified) counter reaction about it being a brand new untested technology etc.

              What that scenario has going against it is that Trumpists seem to make up a good chunk of the 50% who say they won’t take a Covid vaccine at all.

              JollyJ Offline
              JollyJ Offline
              Jolly
              wrote on last edited by
              #8

              @jon-nyc said in Should we take another hard look?:

              @Aqua-Letifer said in Should we take another hard look?:

              When we politicize science that heavily, we're done for. What's next, pro/con covid vaccine along political lines?

              I can almost see it happening, because Trump will likely be pushing for pre-election approval of the mRNA vaccine, which will cause the (not entirely unjustified) counter reaction about it being a brand new untested technology etc.

              What that scenario has going against it is that Trumpists seem to make up a good chunk of the 50% who say they won’t take a Covid vaccine at all.

              I think Trump is going to push for large trials, not a full roll-out. I could be wrong.

              “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

              Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

              jon-nycJ 1 Reply Last reply
              • L Offline
                L Offline
                Loki
                wrote on last edited by
                #9

                There is an overall 99.4% chance of not dying if you get Covid. How long will we keep the world closed?

                1 Reply Last reply
                • jon-nycJ Offline
                  jon-nycJ Offline
                  jon-nyc
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #10

                  Come to NY. We’re pretty much open.

                  Only non-witches get due process.

                  • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                  L 1 Reply Last reply
                  • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

                    Come to NY. We’re pretty much open.

                    L Offline
                    L Offline
                    Loki
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #11

                    @jon-nyc said in Should we take another hard look?:

                    Come to NY. We’re pretty much open.

                    Compare normal NYC to now NYC. It has to be horrifying for people who live there.

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • JollyJ Jolly

                      @jon-nyc said in Should we take another hard look?:

                      @Aqua-Letifer said in Should we take another hard look?:

                      When we politicize science that heavily, we're done for. What's next, pro/con covid vaccine along political lines?

                      I can almost see it happening, because Trump will likely be pushing for pre-election approval of the mRNA vaccine, which will cause the (not entirely unjustified) counter reaction about it being a brand new untested technology etc.

                      What that scenario has going against it is that Trumpists seem to make up a good chunk of the 50% who say they won’t take a Covid vaccine at all.

                      I think Trump is going to push for large trials, not a full roll-out. I could be wrong.

                      jon-nycJ Offline
                      jon-nycJ Offline
                      jon-nyc
                      wrote on last edited by jon-nyc
                      #12

                      @Jolly said in Should we take another hard look?:

                      @jon-nyc said in Should we take another hard look?:

                      @Aqua-Letifer said in Should we take another hard look?:

                      When we politicize science that heavily, we're done for. What's next, pro/con covid vaccine along political lines?

                      I can almost see it happening, because Trump will likely be pushing for pre-election approval of the mRNA vaccine, which will cause the (not entirely unjustified) counter reaction about it being a brand new untested technology etc.

                      What that scenario has going against it is that Trumpists seem to make up a good chunk of the 50% who say they won’t take a Covid vaccine at all.

                      I think Trump is going to push for large trials, not a full roll-out. I could be wrong.

                      There’s an n=30k trial going on now. Though the endpoints are listed at 2 years (Oct 2022, given the lag time of getting 30k people stuck from a 7/20 start), the FDA has made lots of noises about granting pre-approval at the 6 month mark if all is going well.

                      I think Trump will push hard for a late October approval, or at least some creative rebranding of the trial status to make it seem like a pre-election victory.

                      Only non-witches get due process.

                      • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                      jon-nycJ 1 Reply Last reply
                      • jon-nycJ Offline
                        jon-nycJ Offline
                        jon-nyc
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #13

                        I can even imagine him declaring it approved himself on Twitter.

                        Or saying on twitter that it has shown safety and efficacy but the FDA/deep state is trying to keep it ‘suppressed’ to help Biden.

                        Only non-witches get due process.

                        • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                        1 Reply Last reply
                        • L Offline
                          L Offline
                          Loki
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #14

                          Other countries will be out in front of us. We can benefit from their results for decision making.

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          • jon-nycJ Offline
                            jon-nycJ Offline
                            jon-nyc
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #15

                            Yes and no. Both China and a Russia have an ‘approved’ vaccine. But they’re basically doing phase 3 with a different name - ‘limited rollout’.

                            True, they’ll hit a bigger N and will show safety and efficacy earlier. But (a) we won’t necessarily be able to trust their data and (b) the drugs aren’t identical, so it doesn’t help us approve ours any quicker.

                            Only non-witches get due process.

                            • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                            L 1 Reply Last reply
                            • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

                              Yes and no. Both China and a Russia have an ‘approved’ vaccine. But they’re basically doing phase 3 with a different name - ‘limited rollout’.

                              True, they’ll hit a bigger N and will show safety and efficacy earlier. But (a) we won’t necessarily be able to trust their data and (b) the drugs aren’t identical, so it doesn’t help us approve ours any quicker.

                              L Offline
                              L Offline
                              Loki
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #16

                              @jon-nyc said in Should we take another hard look?:

                              Yes and no. Both China and a Russia have an ‘approved’ vaccine. But they’re basically doing phase 3 with a different name - ‘limited rollout’.

                              True, they’ll hit a bigger N and will show safety and efficacy earlier. But (a) we won’t necessarily be able to trust their data and (b) the drugs aren’t identical, so it doesn’t help us approve ours any quicker.

                              I am talking about pressure to move fast. Results will go viral even if people challenge them. We going to just sit there? Really? I doubt it.

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              • jon-nycJ Offline
                                jon-nycJ Offline
                                jon-nyc
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #17

                                Listen to Moderna’s, AZ’s, or Pfizer’s earnings calls. Nobody’s just sitting around.

                                Only non-witches get due process.

                                • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                                1 Reply Last reply
                                • JollyJ Jolly

                                  At an old drug?

                                  https://thefederalist.com/2020/08/20/why-is-the-media-suppressing-information-about-hydroxychloroquines-effectiveness-against-covid/

                                  AxtremusA Away
                                  AxtremusA Away
                                  Axtremus
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #18

                                  @Jolly said in Should we take another hard look?:

                                  At an old drug?

                                  https://thefederalist.com/2020/08/20/why-is-the-media-suppressing-information-about-hydroxychloroquines-effectiveness-against-covid/

                                  Why give "the media" power over what drugs to promote, what drugs to bury?
                                  For that matter, why give any politician power over what drugs to promote, what drugs to bury?

                                  Let the medical establishment do their thing and you pay attention to the medical establishment. The CDC, the FDA, the WHO, the revered academic journals ... pay attention to those.
                                  Yeah, from time to time, they make mistakes.
                                  But they are still a lot than "the media", a lot better than just about any politician.

                                  JollyJ 1 Reply Last reply
                                  • jon-nycJ Offline
                                    jon-nycJ Offline
                                    jon-nyc
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #19

                                    As if on cue.

                                    https://www.cnbc.com/2020/08/23/trump-considering-fast-tracking-astrazeneca-vaccine-before-election.html

                                    But it’s the AZ. Probably a wiser choice, it’s the one the Russians stole so it’s gotten more testing.

                                    Only non-witches get due process.

                                    • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

                                      @Jolly said in Should we take another hard look?:

                                      @jon-nyc said in Should we take another hard look?:

                                      @Aqua-Letifer said in Should we take another hard look?:

                                      When we politicize science that heavily, we're done for. What's next, pro/con covid vaccine along political lines?

                                      I can almost see it happening, because Trump will likely be pushing for pre-election approval of the mRNA vaccine, which will cause the (not entirely unjustified) counter reaction about it being a brand new untested technology etc.

                                      What that scenario has going against it is that Trumpists seem to make up a good chunk of the 50% who say they won’t take a Covid vaccine at all.

                                      I think Trump is going to push for large trials, not a full roll-out. I could be wrong.

                                      There’s an n=30k trial going on now. Though the endpoints are listed at 2 years (Oct 2022, given the lag time of getting 30k people stuck from a 7/20 start), the FDA has made lots of noises about granting pre-approval at the 6 month mark if all is going well.

                                      I think Trump will push hard for a late October approval, or at least some creative rebranding of the trial status to make it seem like a pre-election victory.

                                      jon-nycJ Offline
                                      jon-nycJ Offline
                                      jon-nyc
                                      wrote on last edited by jon-nyc
                                      #20

                                      @jon-nyc said in Should we take another hard look?:

                                      I think Trump will push hard for a late October approval, or at least some creative rebranding of the trial status to make it seem like a pre-election victory.

                                      From the CNBC piece:

                                      One option, according to the FT report, would involve the U.S. Food and Drug Administration awarding “emergency use authorization” for the vaccine, which was developed by Oxford University and AstraZeneca.

                                      Only non-witches get due process.

                                      • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                                      1 Reply Last reply
                                      • jon-nycJ Offline
                                        jon-nycJ Offline
                                        jon-nyc
                                        wrote on last edited by jon-nyc
                                        #21

                                        Funny thing is AZ hasn’t even started recruiting for their big n=30k P3 trial in the US.

                                        They do have an n=5k trial in Brazil though which started dosing last quarter.

                                        Only non-witches get due process.

                                        • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        • jon-nycJ Offline
                                          jon-nycJ Offline
                                          jon-nyc
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #22

                                          Oh wow. The administration told GOP lawmakers they would approve a vaccine before the election but weren’t sure which one. AZ is just considered the best candidate.

                                          https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/23/world/covid-19-coronavirus.html?action=click&module=Top Stories&pgtype=Homepage

                                          Only non-witches get due process.

                                          • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
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