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The New Coffee Room

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  3. A Christian Nation

A Christian Nation

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  • JollyJ Offline
    JollyJ Offline
    Jolly
    wrote on last edited by Jolly
    #1

    Kinda...

    https://americanmind.org/features/what-is-christian-nationalism/the-case-for-christian-civilizationism/

    “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

    Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

    1 Reply Last reply
    • taiwan_girlT Offline
      taiwan_girlT Offline
      taiwan_girl
      wrote on last edited by
      #2

      Interesting article, but I am not sure I follow his point. Christian religion has been around for a couple of thousand years. For 90% of that time, most of the governments that had a Christian population were monarchs.

      I don't think that "democracy" is due to Christians. Weren't the Greeks the "founders" of democracy and they were not Christian. It is more due to a group of people who implemented it, and they could have been any religion. If the religion of Christians was the cause, it should not have taken almost 2000 years to implement after the start of the Christian religion.

      (NOTE: I am not saying that Christians are bad. Not at all)

      RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
      • taiwan_girlT taiwan_girl

        Interesting article, but I am not sure I follow his point. Christian religion has been around for a couple of thousand years. For 90% of that time, most of the governments that had a Christian population were monarchs.

        I don't think that "democracy" is due to Christians. Weren't the Greeks the "founders" of democracy and they were not Christian. It is more due to a group of people who implemented it, and they could have been any religion. If the religion of Christians was the cause, it should not have taken almost 2000 years to implement after the start of the Christian religion.

        (NOTE: I am not saying that Christians are bad. Not at all)

        RenaudaR Offline
        RenaudaR Offline
        Renauda
        wrote on last edited by Renauda
        #3

        @taiwan_girl

        I agree with you. Until the latter part of the 18th century, a major characteristic - arguably even an underlying foundation - of Christian civilization had been hierarchy. Since then the demise of hierarchy has been gradual. I really don’t follow the author’s machinations suggesting or trying to demonstrate it to be otherwise.

        Elbows up!

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        • Doctor PhibesD Online
          Doctor PhibesD Online
          Doctor Phibes
          wrote on last edited by Doctor Phibes
          #4

          From Rome to Britain to America, Christians have found value in a republican government, a charter of rights for citizens, and a healthy non-governmental religion of virtue, honor, and charity.

          Well somebody doesn't know very much about Britain and how it's governed.

          I was only joking

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          • JollyJ Offline
            JollyJ Offline
            Jolly
            wrote on last edited by
            #5

            He's arguing for concentric rings of governance:

            https://lawliberty.org/forum/union-or-empire/

            In short, a turning away from Wilsonian Democracy and instead something more along the lines of Madison's federalist system. And he thinks that the Christian message is powerful enough that even if some men do not convert to Christianity, the benefits are so powerful, that men will enjoy the fruits of its civilization.

            As written in the article:

            "There is plenty for Christians to do politically short of indulging in Christian nationalist pipe dreams. Forget capturing the federal government for the purpose of cracking the whip of Christian morality to “unify” Americans who don’t want it. Instead, why not simply advocate for the restoration of American governance at its best—at its most disunited? A loose union of localized states with concentric rings of representative governance would allow those who wish to live in virtue and preserve Christian civilization. The freedom of association, limited government, and natural law are enough to bring about safety, prosperity, and growth for those who are capable of self-government.

            In such a system, sorting on moral lines is natural. Those who wish to live with Christian values (or at least their societal benefits) in their lives will do so, while others who do not can try their luck with Atheism or perhaps Islam, short of anarchy. The results will speak for themselves.

            Christian nationalism struggles to reify an immature American “nation” with its unwieldy, crumbling government, and thereby leaves no room for this ideal resolution whereby Christian civilization could continue and flourish. I wonder if those proposing a march through the national institutions to the tune of “Onward Christian Soldiers” have confidence in the ability of Christianity to speak for itself, to “out-govern” other moral systems."

            “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

            Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

            RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
            • JollyJ Jolly

              He's arguing for concentric rings of governance:

              https://lawliberty.org/forum/union-or-empire/

              In short, a turning away from Wilsonian Democracy and instead something more along the lines of Madison's federalist system. And he thinks that the Christian message is powerful enough that even if some men do not convert to Christianity, the benefits are so powerful, that men will enjoy the fruits of its civilization.

              As written in the article:

              "There is plenty for Christians to do politically short of indulging in Christian nationalist pipe dreams. Forget capturing the federal government for the purpose of cracking the whip of Christian morality to “unify” Americans who don’t want it. Instead, why not simply advocate for the restoration of American governance at its best—at its most disunited? A loose union of localized states with concentric rings of representative governance would allow those who wish to live in virtue and preserve Christian civilization. The freedom of association, limited government, and natural law are enough to bring about safety, prosperity, and growth for those who are capable of self-government.

              In such a system, sorting on moral lines is natural. Those who wish to live with Christian values (or at least their societal benefits) in their lives will do so, while others who do not can try their luck with Atheism or perhaps Islam, short of anarchy. The results will speak for themselves.

              Christian nationalism struggles to reify an immature American “nation” with its unwieldy, crumbling government, and thereby leaves no room for this ideal resolution whereby Christian civilization could continue and flourish. I wonder if those proposing a march through the national institutions to the tune of “Onward Christian Soldiers” have confidence in the ability of Christianity to speak for itself, to “out-govern” other moral systems."

              RenaudaR Offline
              RenaudaR Offline
              Renauda
              wrote on last edited by Renauda
              #6

              @Jolly

              He's arguing for concentric rings of governance…

              I’ll grant you that his argument is circular but not at all certain if I could describe it as governance.

              Elbows up!

              1 Reply Last reply
              • taiwan_girlT Offline
                taiwan_girlT Offline
                taiwan_girl
                wrote on last edited by
                #7

                The article basically ignores Asia, where I think the only majority Christian country is South Korea, and that is quite recent.

                JollyJ 1 Reply Last reply
                • taiwan_girlT taiwan_girl

                  The article basically ignores Asia, where I think the only majority Christian country is South Korea, and that is quite recent.

                  JollyJ Offline
                  JollyJ Offline
                  Jolly
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #8

                  @taiwan_girl said in A Christian Nation:

                  The article basically ignores Asia, where I think the only majority Christian country is South Korea, and that is quite recent.

                  I would say the article presupposes Western Culture as superior, or at least, more free.

                  “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                  Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

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