More strange and/or foul reactions

[Rainman]

Well-stated, LuFins Dad.
I keep thinking, what am I missing?

[Horace]

I mean the reason the palestinians have support is simple, even if you don't agree with it. They fit perfectly with western progressive victim narratives. That narrative is all but religious to many young westerners (especially female), concerned with their souls and being on the right side of history. And with seeming like good people to their social group. That last bit is getting substantial push back, which is interesting. Usually, facile virtue signals get no pushback.

[George K]

[Horace]

Percentage of female faculty will track with that, though not as prominently.

[George K]

[Horace]

Always uncomfortable watching children play grownup.

[George K]

[Horace]

That mass murder has a catchy beat.

[LuFins Dad]

@George-K said in More strange and/or foul reactions:

This one is a little sketchy, IMO. I don’t like an employee wearing a very controversial symbol or emblem, and imagine that is likely against the rules. Still, pulling out the phone and publicly putting on that kind of display? Dick move. Here’s an idea… If you are that offended by it, quietly approach the manager and tell them or try to engage in a calm and quiet conversation about it with the employee. You might actually have a small opportunity to educate someone or influence their opinion rather than win social media cred…

[Renauda]

France surrenders [again]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-67356581

A Vichy like regime will soon follow.

[jon-nyc]

@LuFins-Dad

I agree with your general sentiment. I think Apple should (and perhaps does?) have rules against putting any kind of political messaging on employee uniforms.

But a Palestinian flag doesn’t necessarily mean ‘I support Hamas and their actions’.

One can confidently hold two thoughts in their head at once: (1) The Palestinian people are treated unjustly and that needs to change somehow and (2) Hamas is a terrorist organization with genocidal aspirations and needs to be physically destroyed.

[Aqua Letifer]

@jon-nyc said in More strange and/or foul reactions:

@LuFins-Dad

One can confidently hold two thoughts in their head at once: (1) The Palestinian people are treated unjustly and that needs to change somehow and (2) Hamas is a terrorist organization with genocidal aspirations and needs to be physically destroyed.

To what extent do you think Palestinians are responsible for Hamas?

[jon-nyc]

To the same extent the Israelis are responsible for Bibi and his policies in the West Bank.

Actually to a much lesser extent. Hamas has long been unpopular in Gaza but the current generation never got a vote.

[jon-nyc]

Interestingly Hamas is more popular than Fatah in the West Bank and Fatah more popular than Hamas in Gaza. At least on 10/6. Not sure what the effects of recent events have been. I’m almost afraid to look into it. It would probably be disappointing.

[Aqua Letifer]

@jon-nyc said in More strange and/or foul reactions:

Hamas has long been unpopular in Gaza

Overall, 57% of Gazans express at least a somewhat positive opinion of Hamas—along with similar percentages of Palestinians in the West Bank (52%) and East Jerusalem (64%)

...half (50%) agreed with the following proposal: “Hamas should stop calling for Israel’s destruction, and instead accept a permanent two-state solution based on the 1967 borders.”

https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/polls-show-majority-gazans-were-against-breaking-ceasefire-hamas-and-hezbollah

[jon-nyc]

From your link, the longstanding result I reference.

In fact, Gazan frustration with Hamas governance is clear; most Gazans expressed a preference for PA administration and security officials over Hamas—the majority of Gazans (70%) supported a proposal of the PA sending “officials and security officers to Gaza to take over the administration there, with Hamas giving up separate armed units,” including 47% who strongly agreed. Nor is this a new view—this proposal has had majority support in Gaza since first polled by The Washington Institute in 2014.

[Aqua Letifer]

@jon-nyc said in More strange and/or foul reactions:

From your link, the longstanding result I reference.

In fact, Gazan frustration with Hamas governance is clear; most Gazans expressed a preference for PA administration and security officials over Hamas—the majority of Gazans (70%) supported a proposal of the PA sending “officials and security officers to Gaza to take over the administration there, with Hamas giving up separate armed units,” including 47% who strongly agreed. Nor is this a new view—this proposal has had majority support in Gaza since first polled by The Washington Institute in 2014.

Yes, I saw that, too, but it doesn't negate what I first posted from there. It seems Murray's point about partial responsibility still stands since Hamas enjoys at least partial support.

[jon-nyc]

Sure. And of course the Israelis are quite a bit more responsible for the actions of Israel in the West Bank.

What are we to infer from those two facts? Is there a point you wish to make?

[Aqua Letifer]

@jon-nyc said in More strange and/or foul reactions:

Sure. And of course the Israelis are quite a bit more responsible for the actions of Israel in the West Bank.

What are we to infer from those two facts? Is there a point you wish to make?

Just that I don't think it makes any rational sense to look at the events of the past month and conclude the real crime is what's happening to the Palestinians. As such, it's weird to fixate on that argument.

[jon-nyc]

It’s true in a sense but Hamas is the perp there too. Virtually every Gazan casualty is a victim of one or two war crimes by Hamas. (1) The use of human shields and (2) not being allowed to flee.