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The New Coffee Room

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  3. Alito: Congress has no authority

Alito: Congress has no authority

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  • George KG George K

    @Mik said in Alito: Congress has no authority:

    SCOTUS has the authority to rein in the legislative and executive branches.

    Not really. SCOTUS determines whether a law is constitutional or not.

    The law is what SCOTUS says it is - see Marbury v Madison.

    And for that matter, SCOTUS really has no authority to regulate how the executive or congress do their business.

    MikM Offline
    MikM Offline
    Mik
    wrote on last edited by
    #6

    @George-K perhaps, but the net effect is the same. See student loan forgiveness.

    “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

    George KG LuFins DadL 2 Replies Last reply
    • MikM Mik

      @George-K perhaps, but the net effect is the same. See student loan forgiveness.

      George KG Offline
      George KG Offline
      George K
      wrote on last edited by
      #7

      @Mik said in Alito: Congress has no authority:

      the net effect is the same

      Perhaps, but the process is different.

      At least it should be.

      We have a spineless Congress that surrenders its obligations to the executive.

      "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

      The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

      1 Reply Last reply
      • MikM Mik

        @George-K perhaps, but the net effect is the same. See student loan forgiveness.

        LuFins DadL Offline
        LuFins DadL Offline
        LuFins Dad
        wrote on last edited by
        #8

        @Mik said in Alito: Congress has no authority:

        @George-K perhaps, but the net effect is the same. See student loan forgiveness.

        Not at all. They simply prevented the Executive from assuming powers that do not belong to that branch. The smaller package he pushed through later is likely fine. Closing errors in administration of the program is within his authority.

        Student Loan Forgiveness can still happen. It just needs to go through Congress, as it always should have been addressed.

        The Brad

        1 Reply Last reply
        • George KG Offline
          George KG Offline
          George K
          wrote on last edited by
          #9

          Flip the question: Other than deciding what is constitutional, what authority over itself has Congress given to the Supreme Court? Does SCOTUS have any authority to conduct ethics, staffing or other administrative issues wrt to Congress?

          "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

          The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

          1 Reply Last reply
          • JollyJ Offline
            JollyJ Offline
            Jolly
            wrote on last edited by
            #10

            No.

            “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

            Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

            1 Reply Last reply
            • MikM Offline
              MikM Offline
              Mik
              wrote on last edited by Mik
              #11

              No, but I would argue that keeping both branches within the Constitutional limits is reining them in and is more important than any other oversight.

              “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

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              • George KG Offline
                George KG Offline
                George K
                wrote on last edited by
                #12

                All three branches...

                As @jolly pointed out, SCOTUS has no standing wrt the student debt forgiveness. That's a matter for Congress.

                What oversight does SCOTUS have over Congress?

                "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                1 Reply Last reply
                • MikM Offline
                  MikM Offline
                  Mik
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #13

                  Making sure the laws they pass are constitutional if challenged.

                  “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

                  George KG 1 Reply Last reply
                  • LuFins DadL Offline
                    LuFins DadL Offline
                    LuFins Dad
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #14

                    Does the budgetary control provide Congress with an implied oversight?

                    The Brad

                    George KG 1 Reply Last reply
                    • LuFins DadL LuFins Dad

                      Does the budgetary control provide Congress with an implied oversight?

                      George KG Offline
                      George KG Offline
                      George K
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #15

                      @LuFins-Dad said in Alito: Congress has no authority:

                      Does the budgetary control provide Congress with an implied oversight?

                      Good question. Seems to wrt the Executive.

                      Is that a Constitutional or legislative thing? IOW, did Congress just legislate itself the ability to oversee the Executive?

                      "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                      The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      • MikM Mik

                        Making sure the laws they pass are constitutional if challenged.

                        George KG Offline
                        George KG Offline
                        George K
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #16

                        @Mik said in Alito: Congress has no authority:

                        Making sure the laws they pass are constitutional if challenged.

                        Which is fundamentally different from saying how they conduct their business - committee selections, rules, and...ethics.

                        "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                        The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        • LuFins DadL Offline
                          LuFins DadL Offline
                          LuFins Dad
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #17

                          Many of the rulings the left is bitching about could have been resolved without even getting to the courts through legislative process, but the Democratic controlled Congress chose not to codify Roe V Wade or Student Loan Forgiveness. Tough on them. The other cases involved preventing Government from infringing on the rights of individuals. They were frankly pretty cut and dry decisions. Implied rights ≠ Explicit rights.

                          This whole oversight issue is not about actually maintaining a true ethical standard for officials, otherwise 2/3rds of Congress would be removed from office. It’s about trying to find a means to punish the court for decisions that Congress doesn’t like. Not their job. Legislating is, and they are doing a damn poor job of it.

                          The Brad

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          • JollyJ Offline
                            JollyJ Offline
                            Jolly
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #18

                            Chose?

                            The beauty of the legislative branch is that some type of consensus is needed to achieve anything. That's good.

                            “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                            Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            • George KG Offline
                              George KG Offline
                              George K
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #19

                              Chris Murphy: Alito ‘stunningly wrong’ in saying Congress can’t regulate SCOTUS

                              “It’s just stunningly wrong. And he should know that more than anyone else because his seat on the Supreme Court exists only because of an act passed by Congress,” Murphy said Sunday during an interview on CNN’s “State of the Union.”

                              Murphy slammed Alito’s remarks to the Journal, saying Sunday it is “even more disturbing that Alito feels the need to insert himself into a congressional debate.”

                              “It’s just more evidence that these justices on the Supreme Court, these conservative justices, just see themselves as politicians. They just see themselves as a second legislative body that has just as much power and weight to impose their political will on the country as Congress does,” Murphy told host Kasie Hunt.

                              “It’s why we need to pass this common sense ethics legislation to at least make sure we know that these guys aren’t in bed having their lifestyles paid for by conservative donors, as we have unfortunately seen in these latest revelations.”

                              Pass the popcorn. Congress passes "common sense legislation." Someone (with standing - a SCOTUS Justice, perhaps?) sues. SCOTUS determines such legislation is unconstitutional based on separation of powers.

                              "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                              The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              • JollyJ Offline
                                JollyJ Offline
                                Jolly
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #20

                                Do not interfere in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with catsup.

                                “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                                Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                • taiwan_girlT Online
                                  taiwan_girlT Online
                                  taiwan_girl
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #21

                                  To me, it makes sense to have some sort of "ethics" requirements, no matter who puts it in place, even if they do it themself.

                                  Not sure why the Supreme Court judges seem to be resisting it.

                                  George KG 1 Reply Last reply
                                  • JollyJ Offline
                                    JollyJ Offline
                                    Jolly
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #22

                                    They police themselves. For the most part, they do a much better job than Congress.

                                    “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                                    Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    • taiwan_girlT taiwan_girl

                                      To me, it makes sense to have some sort of "ethics" requirements, no matter who puts it in place, even if they do it themself.

                                      Not sure why the Supreme Court judges seem to be resisting it.

                                      George KG Offline
                                      George KG Offline
                                      George K
                                      wrote on last edited by George K
                                      #23

                                      @taiwan_girl said in Alito: Congress has no authority:

                                      Not sure why the Supreme Court judges seem to be resisting it.

                                      Co-equal branch, and it's a matter of not letting the camel poke its nose under the tent flap principle. The Supreme Court has no authority over how Congress elects its committee memberships, what the rules for legislation are, or what ethics rules it implements. That door swings both ways.

                                      "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                                      The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                                      taiwan_girlT 1 Reply Last reply
                                      • George KG George K

                                        @taiwan_girl said in Alito: Congress has no authority:

                                        Not sure why the Supreme Court judges seem to be resisting it.

                                        Co-equal branch, and it's a matter of not letting the camel poke its nose under the tent flap principle. The Supreme Court has no authority over how Congress elects its committee memberships, what the rules for legislation are, or what ethics rules it implements. That door swings both ways.

                                        taiwan_girlT Online
                                        taiwan_girlT Online
                                        taiwan_girl
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #24

                                        @George-K said in Alito: Congress has no authority:

                                        @taiwan_girl said in Alito: Congress has no authority:

                                        Not sure why the Supreme Court judges seem to be resisting it.

                                        Co-equal branch, and it's a matter of not letting the camel poke its nose under the tent flap principle. The Supreme Court has no authority over how Congress elects its committee memberships, what the rules for legislation are, or what ethics rules it implements. That door swings both ways.

                                        I absolutely understand that. But, it would be pretty easy to write up a set of standards for themselfs. It just does not look good.

                                        As you have say, "it is the appearance"

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        • JollyJ Offline
                                          JollyJ Offline
                                          Jolly
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #25

                                          Well, they've made it a couple of hundred years and change, without congressional "oversight".

                                          “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                                          Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

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