Homophobic
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If you like Russia so much, why don’t you go and live there?
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If you like Russia so much, why don’t you go and live there?
@Doctor-Phibes said in Homophobic:
If you like Russia so much, why don’t you go and live there?
Is that why you're in America? Couldn't stand Blighty?
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@Doctor-Phibes said in Homophobic:
If you like Russia so much, why don’t you go and live there?
Is that why you're in America? Couldn't stand Blighty?
@Jolly said in Homophobic:
@Doctor-Phibes said in Homophobic:
If you like Russia so much, why don’t you go and live there?
Is that why you're in America? Couldn't stand Blighty?
I actually left the UK to go to Canada, and then came here primarily for the job, but I do really like it here, despite what I might occasionally say.
The UK has a lot of good points, but there's a lot wrong with it, too. If only their employment opportunities were as good as their comedy and their beer.
But to the original point, I would say the Russian State attitude to homosexuality is pretty barbaric.
And anybody who thinks that it's a Christian state is delusional.
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The Russian attitude may be barbaric, but look at the societal mess we're in. Maybe there needs to be some discrimination to avoid a slippery slope. Not what the Russians are doing, but something short of the pit of silliness we have become.
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The Russian attitude may be barbaric, but look at the societal mess we're in. Maybe there needs to be some discrimination to avoid a slippery slope. Not what the Russians are doing, but something short of the pit of silliness we have become.
@Jolly said in Homophobic:
The Russian attitude may be barbaric, but look at the societal mess we're in. Maybe there needs to be some discrimination to avoid a slippery slope. Not what the Russians are doing, but something short of the pit of silliness we have become.
You think Christianity is a necessary influence on American culture. But if Christianity were used to justify publicizing the addresses and children's names of atheists, destroying the professional reputations of agnostics, assaulting Buddhists in the streets, destroying Jewish statues, etc., I'd say well, that's not really Christianity. What we'd have there would be totalitarianism that found an in by masquerading as Christianity. (And let's not forget we did indeed have that problem before.)
I think it's the same here. It's not like homosexuality up and got invented in our lifetimes, or that it brings demise everywhere it manifests. If that were true we'd have no societies. We've got totalitarianism being dabbled with and introduced via other means.
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I think there is a lot wrong for society, when you mainstream alternative lifestyles. In any society, for it to prosper, the society must decide and decide well, what constitutes what is best and what is ideal for society, and then discriminate against those things which are bad. That discrimination can range from the legal to simple acknowledgement that an act or state of being is not good for society.
Polygamy is not legal. Nor should it be. Creating children and then refusing to care for them is not legal. Nor should it be. Theft, random violence, rape, etc., all are illegal acts, because we have agreed they should be. And as I've stated repeatedly, the law is codified morality.
Then there are behaviors or actions, that while not illegal, are not good for society. Alcoholism would be an example of something that in itself is not illegal, but something most people would agree is not good for the individual or the society he lives in. Sloth and sponging off a benevolent society is not illegal, but I think we could agree it is not desirable and should be discouraged.
So let's talk about homosexuality and whether it is good for society. I don't think it is, as I do not see its benefits. It doesn't create children, it does not create strong families, and at some levels it embraces a very promiscuous lifestyle which is not good for society, either. And if we do hearken back to those Judeo-Christian roots of the country, it's something that has never been desired in those societies.
But, we have decided on a Republic with a vast amount of individual Liberty. If a person wishes to be homosexual, it's within his rights to do so. Peace be unto you, live long and prosper, but we as a society should not look on that as an optimal lifestyle or one that should be promoted or even given equal footing in many areas. And yes, I'm speaking about gay marriage, which is something I feel simply should not be, as it undermines a bedrock institution of our society. Civil unions, fine. Marruage, no.
What has our acceptance of gay marriage given us? As we mainstream this behavior, those behaviors which were even more detrimental, now clamor for acceptance. Why aren't drag queens around our children acceptable? Why isn't pedophilia acceptable? If two people love each other, why shouldn't a fifteen year-old have sex with a thirty year-old. The slippery slope does exist and in this case, it exists with a vengeance.
We are not the Russians. We have not made it a crime to be homosexual. We do not lock them up (although we did at one time) and we do not dox them. But... I can understand why Russia, when it looks at the U.S. and much of Europe, has decided that some of the behavior is too decadent for their society to accept. Maybe that has roots in the Orthodox Church, I don't know.
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America is supposed to be about freedom.
Freedom by its very nature involves people being allowed to behave in ways we don't approve of or consider to be sub-optimal for society. We don't actually get to decide whether or not this is acceptable.
IMHO, many of the problems we currently have isn't because of homosexuality, it's because of groups of people, particularly (but certainly not exclusively) on the left, trying to censor others from expressing themselves. Reacting to this by trying to do the same thing to them isn't going to make things better, it's going to exacerbate the problem.
I was only joking
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America is about freedom, but total freedom is anarchy and detrimental to society. Just as predatory pure capitalism is not something we practice, either. We spend an awful lot of money, time and energy to try to protect people from encroachments on their freedoms or livelihoods by other people.
Also, with freedom comes responsibilities and we've done a lousy job at that for several decades. In order for the Republic to work, people have to be educated and informed. They have to know how their government works, what branch does what, and above all, what the Constitution does and what it means.
Lastly, and that's in the tenor of this thread, we have to weigh things as a society to determine whether they are detrimental to society or beneficial. We'd like to promote those things that are beneficial to society and discourage those that are not. That discouragement can range from criminal law, civil law, to simple societal disapproval. In the theme of this thread (as it has developed) I think homosexuality should be simple societal disapprovals. IOW, the class is not to be persecuted, but is certainly not to be held up as a simple alternative, as it is in many quarters.
Lastly, your last paragraph describes simple politics and that happens anytime you have more than one person in a room. The more the number of people, the higher the amount of politics. Man is always jockeying for leadership or to do what he wishes, and politics is the art of the possible. Sometimes that possible does bleed over into expression, although that's another slippery slope, best avoided.
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America is supposed to be about freedom.
Freedom by its very nature involves people being allowed to behave in ways we don't approve of or consider to be sub-optimal for society. We don't actually get to decide whether or not this is acceptable.
IMHO, many of the problems we currently have isn't because of homosexuality, it's because of groups of people, particularly (but certainly not exclusively) on the left, trying to censor others from expressing themselves. Reacting to this by trying to do the same thing to them isn't going to make things better, it's going to exacerbate the problem.
@Doctor-Phibes said in Homophobic:
Freedom by its very nature involves people being allowed to
It's more like people are not prohibited from...
There is a difference.
The behavior in question is not prohibited, neither is the distaste for it.
