Skip to content
  • Categories
  • Recent
  • Tags
  • Popular
  • Users
  • Groups
Skins
  • Light
  • Cerulean
  • Cosmo
  • Flatly
  • Journal
  • Litera
  • Lumen
  • Lux
  • Materia
  • Minty
  • Morph
  • Pulse
  • Sandstone
  • Simplex
  • Sketchy
  • Spacelab
  • United
  • Yeti
  • Zephyr
  • Dark
  • Cyborg
  • Darkly
  • Quartz
  • Slate
  • Solar
  • Superhero
  • Vapor

  • Default (No Skin)
  • No Skin
Collapse

The New Coffee Room

  1. TNCR
  2. General Discussion
  3. The Rise of Poland

The Rise of Poland

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved General Discussion
8 Posts 4 Posters 155 Views
  • Oldest to Newest
  • Newest to Oldest
  • Most Votes
Reply
  • Reply as topic
Log in to reply
This topic has been deleted. Only users with topic management privileges can see it.
  • RenaudaR Offline
    RenaudaR Offline
    Renauda
    wrote on last edited by Renauda
    #1

    So as not to derail the CNN Trump Townhall thread I thought a separate thread was in order.

    Jolly asked:

    In the eternal balancing act between guns & butter and considering Germany's view of the military since WW2, has the equation slid so far towards social services that Germany can no longer field an effective military? Or pay for its own defense?

    American, British and French policy since WWII up to and arguably beyond the reunification of Germany and the subsequent dissolution of the USSR, has been to keep Germany from militarizing and maintain a status quo position as a junior member of NATO. That policy only began to change slightly following the NATO conflict with Serbia and the war in Afghanistan following the Twin Towers attack and the invocation of NATO’s Article 5.

    As it presently stands Germany has no real desire to rearm beyond its minimal NATO commitment. Nor am I am really convinced that France, the UK and other European NATO members really want it to rearm.

    Enter Poland to fill the continental power void;

    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/europes-centre-of-gravity-is-shifting-towards-poland/

    While it makes sense that Poland is eager to fill the gap, you can be rest assured it is not well received in Moscow or Berlin.

    Elbows up!

    George KG 1 Reply Last reply
    • RenaudaR Renauda

      So as not to derail the CNN Trump Townhall thread I thought a separate thread was in order.

      Jolly asked:

      In the eternal balancing act between guns & butter and considering Germany's view of the military since WW2, has the equation slid so far towards social services that Germany can no longer field an effective military? Or pay for its own defense?

      American, British and French policy since WWII up to and arguably beyond the reunification of Germany and the subsequent dissolution of the USSR, has been to keep Germany from militarizing and maintain a status quo position as a junior member of NATO. That policy only began to change slightly following the NATO conflict with Serbia and the war in Afghanistan following the Twin Towers attack and the invocation of NATO’s Article 5.

      As it presently stands Germany has no real desire to rearm beyond its minimal NATO commitment. Nor am I am really convinced that France, the UK and other European NATO members really want it to rearm.

      Enter Poland to fill the continental power void;

      https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/europes-centre-of-gravity-is-shifting-towards-poland/

      While it makes sense that Poland is eager to fill the gap, you can be rest assured it is not well received in Moscow or Berlin.

      George KG Offline
      George KG Offline
      George K
      wrote on last edited by
      #2

      @Renauda said in The Rise of Poland:

      you can be rest assured it is not well received in Moscow or Berlin.

      Yeah, those memories are trans-generational.

      "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

      The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

      RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
      • George KG George K

        @Renauda said in The Rise of Poland:

        you can be rest assured it is not well received in Moscow or Berlin.

        Yeah, those memories are trans-generational.

        RenaudaR Offline
        RenaudaR Offline
        Renauda
        wrote on last edited by
        #3

        @George-K

        It’s the little big things the Poles are doing that infuriate Moscow. For example this from just yesterday:

        https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2023/05/10/poland-changes-kaliningrads-official-name-in-move-against-russification-a81086

        Elbows up!

        1 Reply Last reply
        • MikM Offline
          MikM Offline
          Mik
          wrote on last edited by
          #4

          Russia seems shocked that Poland would offend them. Get used to it.

          “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

          1 Reply Last reply
          • MikM Offline
            MikM Offline
            Mik
            wrote on last edited by
            #5

            Interesting piece on autocratic regimes in both Turkey and Poland. Not quite sure how to interpret the Polish side.

            https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/democratic-backsliding-in-turkey-poland-is-a-threat-to-all-of-nato/ar-AA1b4gQc?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=53309096e3f14b909a98335c979ef22b&ei=20

            “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

            RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
            • MikM Mik

              Interesting piece on autocratic regimes in both Turkey and Poland. Not quite sure how to interpret the Polish side.

              https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/democratic-backsliding-in-turkey-poland-is-a-threat-to-all-of-nato/ar-AA1b4gQc?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=53309096e3f14b909a98335c979ef22b&ei=20

              RenaudaR Offline
              RenaudaR Offline
              Renauda
              wrote on last edited by Renauda
              #6

              @Mik

              Good piece.

              Will be interesting to see what happens in the upcoming Turkish election. At 44% inflation along with the populist slow boat away from secular governance that pits urban against rural, Erdogan’s 20 year hold on power appears to be in question.

              Poland is a whole other question. It is staunchly nationalist and socially conservative to the core. The anecdote that it is more Catholic than the Vatican is not all mirthful hyperbole. Like Russians and Ukrainians, Poles sleep with a history text under their pillow. As a result they are only too aware of their geographical location and the resulting vulnerability. Most of all, Poles are sceptical of Western liberalism because they feel it betrayed their nation first, in 1939 then again at Yalta five years later. What we see in Poland presently is not dissimilar to the piece that Jolly posted two days ago by Victor David Hanson that describes America’s impending Thermidorian reaction.

              Elbows up!

              1 Reply Last reply
              • JollyJ Offline
                JollyJ Offline
                Jolly
                wrote on last edited by
                #7

                Well, nobody ever said the Poles lacked courage or the will to fight...

                “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                1 Reply Last reply
                • RenaudaR Offline
                  RenaudaR Offline
                  Renauda
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #8

                  And since the upcoming Turkish election was mentioned, it seems that the outcome may be of great interest to the Kremlin:

                  https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-65574312

                  Elbows up!

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  Reply
                  • Reply as topic
                  Log in to reply
                  • Oldest to Newest
                  • Newest to Oldest
                  • Most Votes


                  • Login

                  • Don't have an account? Register

                  • Login or register to search.
                  • First post
                    Last post
                  0
                  • Categories
                  • Recent
                  • Tags
                  • Popular
                  • Users
                  • Groups