Warren: "Reform SCOTUS"

[Horace]

Court packing?

I think it was @Doctor-Phibes and @jon-nyc recently who've held Warren up as preferable to deSantis. Nice to get a glimpse of what we can expect.

But gee how could she be worse than DeSantis simultaneously shrinking government, and sending a message to private companies who do business with the government, to stop taking sides in culture war issues the voters care about?

[jon-nyc]

Not me blasphemer. I’ve never called her preferable to anyone.

[George K]

@jon-nyc said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

Not me blasphemer. I’ve never called her preferable to anyone.

Yeah, @jon-nyc is no fan of hers.

[Horace]

@jon-nyc said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

Not me blasphemer. I’ve never called her preferable to anyone.

Right you said they were cut from the same cloth. So now we'll have a case in point to compare the two. We'll see if they sniff of a facile both sides are equalizing.

[Horace]

@George-K said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

@jon-nyc said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

Not me blasphemer. I’ve never called her preferable to anyone.

Yeah, @jon-nyc is no fan of hers.

Neither is Phibes. She is just a calibrator they both used to demonstrate their disdain for DiSantis.

[Jolly]

[Doctor Phibes]

@Horace said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

I think it was @Doctor-Phibes and @jon-nyc recently who've held Warren up as preferable to deSantis. Nice to get a glimpse of what we can expect.

No, I didn't say she was preferable. I said she wasn't a hypocrite in the same way since she's a self-described "left-winger" who believes in government interference. DeSantis is a self-described "conservative" who believes in government interference.

[Horace]

@Doctor-Phibes said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

@Horace said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

I think it was @Doctor-Phibes and @jon-nyc recently who've held Warren up as preferable to deSantis. Nice to get a glimpse of what we can expect.

No, I didn't say she was preferable. I said she wasn't a hypocrite in the same way since she's a self-described "left-winger" who believes in government interference.

You said her "interference was less distasteful than Desantis". I know that I cannot present any good faith rewording of that to present a preference of any sort. That's not how political discussions with sworn nihilists work. My bad.

DeSantis is a self-described "conservative" who believes in government interference.

You've bought, uncritically, that disingenuous framing of DeSantis. DeSantis messaged an intent to roll back an unprincipled public/private relationship between his state and Disney, because the people who voted for him were unhappy that the private part of that relationship was taking sides against them in the culture wars.

None of that is actually unprincipled. You have accepted a lie.

[Doctor Phibes]

@Horace said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

@Doctor-Phibes said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

@Horace said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

I think it was @Doctor-Phibes and @jon-nyc recently who've held Warren up as preferable to deSantis. Nice to get a glimpse of what we can expect.

No, I didn't say she was preferable. I said she wasn't a hypocrite in the same way since she's a self-described "left-winger" who believes in government interference.

You said her "interference was less distasteful than Desantis". I know that I cannot present any good faith rewording of that to present a preference of any sort. That's not how political discussions with sworn nihilists work. My bad.

DeSantis is a self-described "conservative" who believes in government interference.

You've bought, uncritically, that disingenuous framing of DeSantis. DeSantis messaged an intent to roll back an unprincipled public/private relationship between his state and Disney, because the people who voted for him were unhappy that the private part of that relationship was taking sides against them in the culture wars.

None of that is actually unprincipled. You have accepted a lie.

Thanks for letting me know. I'd wondered what my thought process was to arrive at the conclusion I came to, and now I know.

I look forward to you telling me how I came to all my other opinions. With any luck, I'll find that some of them came from Adolf Hitler.

[Horace]

@Doctor-Phibes said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

@Horace said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

@Doctor-Phibes said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

@Horace said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

I think it was @Doctor-Phibes and @jon-nyc recently who've held Warren up as preferable to deSantis. Nice to get a glimpse of what we can expect.

No, I didn't say she was preferable. I said she wasn't a hypocrite in the same way since she's a self-described "left-winger" who believes in government interference.

You said her "interference was less distasteful than Desantis". I know that I cannot present any good faith rewording of that to present a preference of any sort. That's not how political discussions with sworn nihilists work. My bad.

DeSantis is a self-described "conservative" who believes in government interference.

You've bought, uncritically, that disingenuous framing of DeSantis. DeSantis messaged an intent to roll back an unprincipled public/private relationship between his state and Disney, because the people who voted for him were unhappy that the private part of that relationship was taking sides against them in the culture wars.

None of that is actually unprincipled. You have accepted a lie.

Thanks for letting me know. I'd wondered what my thought process was to arrive at the conclusion I came to, and now I know.

I look forward to you telling me how I came to all my other opinions. With any luck, I'll find that some of them came from Adolf Hitler.

There were plenty of actual ideas you could have responded to. For instance you can attempt to tell me why my framing of DeSantis is wrong.

[Doctor Phibes]

@Horace said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

@Doctor-Phibes said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

@Horace said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

@Doctor-Phibes said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

@Horace said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

I think it was @Doctor-Phibes and @jon-nyc recently who've held Warren up as preferable to deSantis. Nice to get a glimpse of what we can expect.

No, I didn't say she was preferable. I said she wasn't a hypocrite in the same way since she's a self-described "left-winger" who believes in government interference.

You said her "interference was less distasteful than Desantis". I know that I cannot present any good faith rewording of that to present a preference of any sort. That's not how political discussions with sworn nihilists work. My bad.

DeSantis is a self-described "conservative" who believes in government interference.

You've bought, uncritically, that disingenuous framing of DeSantis. DeSantis messaged an intent to roll back an unprincipled public/private relationship between his state and Disney, because the people who voted for him were unhappy that the private part of that relationship was taking sides against them in the culture wars.

None of that is actually unprincipled. You have accepted a lie.

Thanks for letting me know. I'd wondered what my thought process was to arrive at the conclusion I came to, and now I know.

I look forward to you telling me how I came to all my other opinions. With any luck, I'll find that some of them came from Adolf Hitler.

There were plenty of actual ideas you could have responded to. For instance you can attempt to tell me why my framing of DeSantis is wrong.

Well, I believe I'm possibly a tad more cynical about conservative politicians than you are. I find it highly coincidental that deSantis picked this moment to interfere with Disney's operation.

You can ascribe to him all the qualities you want in a believer in the Free Market if you wish. It's all a matter of opinion after all.

I've come to a conclusion about his motivation, which I don't feel is unreasonable. Politicians of all colours tend to be really big on people's freedom to do what they like, as long as it's things they approve of. Once folk stray away from that behaviour, things tend to go south quickly.

I think deSantis is using this as an opportunity to appeal to the anti-woke sentiment. Some of what his supporters here have said would support that conclusion.

However, at the end of the day, neither of us actually knows. Only he does.

[jon-nyc]

@Horace said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

For instance you can attempt to tell me why my framing of DeSantis is wrong.

The reedy creek development district was hardly unprincipled. It was quite practical, which is why FL has over 1000 of them. Does it really make sense for some county architecture board to have to approve every new light post in Animal Kingdom?

And DeSantis ultimately left the structure in place.

[Horace]

@Doctor-Phibes said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

@Horace said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

@Doctor-Phibes said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

@Horace said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

@Doctor-Phibes said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

@Horace said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

I think it was @Doctor-Phibes and @jon-nyc recently who've held Warren up as preferable to deSantis. Nice to get a glimpse of what we can expect.

No, I didn't say she was preferable. I said she wasn't a hypocrite in the same way since she's a self-described "left-winger" who believes in government interference.

You said her "interference was less distasteful than Desantis". I know that I cannot present any good faith rewording of that to present a preference of any sort. That's not how political discussions with sworn nihilists work. My bad.

DeSantis is a self-described "conservative" who believes in government interference.

You've bought, uncritically, that disingenuous framing of DeSantis. DeSantis messaged an intent to roll back an unprincipled public/private relationship between his state and Disney, because the people who voted for him were unhappy that the private part of that relationship was taking sides against them in the culture wars.

None of that is actually unprincipled. You have accepted a lie.

Thanks for letting me know. I'd wondered what my thought process was to arrive at the conclusion I came to, and now I know.

I look forward to you telling me how I came to all my other opinions. With any luck, I'll find that some of them came from Adolf Hitler.

There were plenty of actual ideas you could have responded to. For instance you can attempt to tell me why my framing of DeSantis is wrong.

Well, I believe I'm possibly a tad more cynical about conservative politicians than you are. I find it highly coincidental that deSantis picked this moment to interfere with Disney's operation.

You can ascribe to him all the qualities you want in a believer in the Free Market if you wish. It's all a matter of opinion after all.

I've come to a conclusion about his motivation, which I don't feel is unreasonable. Politicians of all colours tend to be really big on people's freedom to do what they like, as long as it's things they approve of. Once folk stray away from that behaviour, things tend to go south quickly.

I think deSantis is using this as an opportunity to appeal to the anti-woke sentiment. Some of what his supporters here have said would support that conclusion.

However, at the end of the day, neither of us actually knows. Only he does.

His motivations are political. It is not a revelation to anybody that he is striking a blow in the culture wars with this Disney stuff. That is not a bad thing per se, nor an unprincipled thing. The mechanism by which he strikes that blow is important. I would actually be with you and Jon if DeSantis had overreached with government power to punish Disney in a new and creative economic way. But in fact his mechanism was to roll back an unprincipled public/private business relationship. That makes all the difference, for those of us who would like to discuss the actual principles at play here.

[Jolly]

Striking a blow?

If we want to save the country, it's almost time for a holy war. Anything legal and not involving bullets.

[Copper]

@jon-nyc said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

Does it really make sense for some county architecture board to have to approve every new light post in Animal Kingdom?

No, not when Disney is being a responsible citizen.

When Disney is cutting staff and tightening the belt, it might be different.

Then the fox is guarding the hen house.

[Horace]

Every new golf course community probably gets its own CDD. They are business relationships with the government, rather than rights, and there is nothing unprincipled about the government adjusting that business relationship, if the community under them begins behaving in ways the voters are importantly opposed to. The principles here hang on whether DeSantis is aligned with his voters. Obviously, he is. And those voters get to claim in good faith, to have conservative principles in the culture war.

[jon-nyc]

There is something unprincipled about “adjusting the relationship” if it’s done to punish political speech, which obviously this was.

[Horace]

@jon-nyc said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

There is something unprincipled about “adjusting the relationship” if it’s done to punish political speech, which obviously this was.

When an unprincipled but expedient public/private business relationship runs up against important cultural principles that voters are allowed to care about, then that business relationship can be adjusted, of course within the law. The voters are allowed to pick and choose with whom they do business. They are allowed to vote for politicians who will make those choices on their behalf. They would not be allowed to throw Disney management in prison or sick the IRS on them.

[Jolly]

@Horace said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

@jon-nyc said in Warren: "Reform SCOTUS":

There is something unprincipled about “adjusting the relationship” if it’s done to punish political speech, which obviously this was.

When an unprincipled but expedient public/private business relationship runs up against important cultural principles that voters are allowed to care about, then that business relationship can be adjusted, of course within the law. The voters are allowed to pick and choose with whom they do business. They are allowed to vote for politicians who will make those choices on their behalf. They would not be allowed to throw Disney management in prison or sick the IRS on them.

No, only the Biden Justice Department can do the latter,