Alec Baldwin Charged
-
wrote on 15 Apr 2024, 22:43 last edited by
Is there an established narrative for how the live ammo got onto set and into the prop gun? tl;dr version?
-
@Renauda said in Alec Baldwin Charged:
I would say the judge is doing her job in accordance to the responsibilities her job entails and bestows upon her.
I watched most of the trial, or at least the nightly summaries.
-
Gutierrez's attorney was a doofus. He was incompetent and unengaged. The witnesses he called were worse than useless - they damage her case. During the police interview prior to trial he sat like a turd, and NEVER intervened ("Don't answer that").
-
The DA, Morrissey, was really excellent. She's a barracuda with a keen mind and never, ever, lets go. She used to be a public defender, and she knows the ropes.
-
The judge was a hard-ass.
Like I said, the judge and the DA will be there in July for Baldwin.
My opinion? He's guilty as well.
-
-
Is there an established narrative for how the live ammo got onto set and into the prop gun? tl;dr version?
wrote on 15 Apr 2024, 22:56 last edited by@Horace said in Alec Baldwin Charged:
Is there an established narrative for how the live ammo got onto set and into the prop gun? tl;dr version?
No.
One theory is that Gutierrez got the ammo in a box from a supplier in LA. In the box, apparently, there were dummy rounds, blanks, and live rounds.
That box DID make it to the set.
@Renauda said:
he was manager in charge who handled the weapon and pulled the trigger
And the state's bar for proving guilt is pretty low:
- Did he point the gun at Hitchens?
- Did he pull the trigger?
- Was there a live round in the pistol?
- Was she killed?
That's it. They have no other burden than those simple things.
As I mentioned, New Mexico Supreme Court has, in the past, ruled that "I didn't know it was loaded" is not a valid defense.
-
wrote on 15 Apr 2024, 23:27 last edited by
See, I don’t buy that. No mens rea. Baldwin had every expectation that the gun was safe.
-
wrote on 15 Apr 2024, 23:32 last edited by
Let the courts decide. Baldwin has the means to appeal if he doesn’t like the verdict of this trial.
-
wrote on 15 Apr 2024, 23:37 last edited by
@Mik said in Alec Baldwin Charged:
. No mens rea. Baldwin had every expectation that the gun was safe.
Mens rea has nothing to do with it. If he had known the gun was unsafe, he would either not have fired it (in a scene where there was no camera rolling, by the way), or be on trial for murder, not homicide.
-
wrote on 16 Apr 2024, 00:03 last edited by
I'd forgotten about this.
Gutierrez also took a selfie with her holding guns.
In a bathroom.
In a bar (where firearms are prohibited).She's under indictment for that.
-
wrote on 16 Apr 2024, 00:09 last edited by
I bet most other movie armorers are with the judge on this one. They are probably disgusted at this blight on their profession.
-
@Mik said in Alec Baldwin Charged:
. No mens rea. Baldwin had every expectation that the gun was safe.
Mens rea has nothing to do with it. If he had known the gun was unsafe, he would either not have fired it (in a scene where there was no camera rolling, by the way), or be on trial for murder, not homicide.
wrote on 16 Apr 2024, 00:10 last edited by@George-K said in Alec Baldwin Charged:
@Mik said in Alec Baldwin Charged:
. No mens rea. Baldwin had every expectation that the gun was safe.
Mens rea has nothing to do with it. If he had known the gun was unsafe, he would either not have fired it (in a scene where there was no camera rolling, by the way), or be on trial for murder, not homicide.
I think it does.
“I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill
-
wrote on 16 Apr 2024, 00:22 last edited by
-
@George-K said in Alec Baldwin Charged:
@Mik said in Alec Baldwin Charged:
. No mens rea. Baldwin had every expectation that the gun was safe.
Mens rea has nothing to do with it. If he had known the gun was unsafe, he would either not have fired it (in a scene where there was no camera rolling, by the way), or be on trial for murder, not homicide.
I think it does.
wrote on 16 Apr 2024, 00:30 last edited by@Mik said in Alec Baldwin Charged:
@George-K said in Alec Baldwin Charged:
@Mik said in Alec Baldwin Charged:
. No mens rea. Baldwin had every expectation that the gun was safe.
Mens rea has nothing to do with it. If he had known the gun was unsafe, he would either not have fired it (in a scene where there was no camera rolling, by the way), or be on trial for murder, not homicide.
I think it does.
Mens Rea would be important on murder 1-3 charges, but not on involuntary homicide charges. These are charges based on negligence, not intent.
-
wrote on 16 Apr 2024, 00:32 last edited by
The drunk driver doesn't plan on killing anyone, but can be found criminally liable.
"Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08
The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.
-
wrote on 16 Apr 2024, 00:42 last edited by
Yes, driving drunk.
-
wrote on 16 Apr 2024, 00:49 last edited by Doctor Phibes
@George-K said in Alec Baldwin Charged:
The drunk driver doesn't plan on killing anyone, but can be found criminally liable.
As in most things, I'm not in any way an expert, but couldn't somebody argue that Baldwin's case is closer to somebody servicing his car and failing to attach the brakes correctly? Is the fact that a movie gun was supplied with live rounds really be something he should be expected to predict?
-
@George-K said in Alec Baldwin Charged:
The drunk driver doesn't plan on killing anyone, but can be found criminally liable.
As in most things, I'm not in any way an expert, but couldn't somebody argue that Baldwin's case is closer to somebody servicing his car and failing to attach the brakes correctly? Is the fact that a movie gun was supplied with live rounds really be something he should be expected to predict?
wrote on 16 Apr 2024, 00:55 last edited by@Doctor-Phibes said in Alec Baldwin Charged:
Is the fact that a movie gun
It's not a "movie gun." It's a real pistol.
he should be expected to predict?
Yes. Watch the video that I posted. He knew it was a real gun. He cocked the hammer and pulled the trigger...in a scene that was not being filmed. They were blocking it.
Also, the SAG code of conduct (or whatever it's called) states that in the case of firearms on the set, the ultimate responsibility lies with the person holding the weapon. That's not a legal argument, but it's something that Baldwin, as a member of the SAG, should be aware of.
-
wrote on 16 Apr 2024, 00:59 last edited by
Can we just go ahead and agree that always assuming a real gun is loaded without personally proving otherwise is a good idea?
-
Can we just go ahead and agree that always assuming a real gun is loaded without personally proving otherwise is a good idea?
wrote on 16 Apr 2024, 01:05 last edited by Doctor Phibes@Aqua-Letifer said in Alec Baldwin Charged:
Can we just go ahead and agree that always assuming a real gun is loaded without personally proving otherwise is a good idea?
Well yeah, we're also always told to never ever point a gun at anybody except in self-defence even when it isn't loaded, but this is a movie, and they have to point guns at each other.
I guess we'll see what happens in court.
I was only joking
-
@Aqua-Letifer said in Alec Baldwin Charged:
Can we just go ahead and agree that always assuming a real gun is loaded without personally proving otherwise is a good idea?
Well yeah, we're also always told to never ever point a gun at anybody except in self-defence even when it isn't loaded, but this is a movie, and they have to point guns at each other.
I guess we'll see what happens in court.
wrote on 16 Apr 2024, 01:18 last edited by George K@Doctor-Phibes said in Alec Baldwin Charged:
I guess we'll see what happens in court.
The problem(s) include Baldwin's constantly changing story. When interrogated by police, the first time, he said that he had extensive experience with firearms. During a second interview, he said that he really didn't know about them.
He claimed he never pulled the trigger, which in a single-action revolver, is impossible to happen without cocking it first.
His comments to police (and press) are inconsistent and at times contradictory. Prosecutor Morrissey will not be kind.
Finally, speaking to mens rea, Baldwin's mind was somewhere else when Hutchins was being airlifted off the set. He was discussing his upcoming vacation with his family. Of course, that's legally irrelevant, but it goes to show you what an a-hole Baldwin is.
-
@Doctor-Phibes said in Alec Baldwin Charged:
I guess we'll see what happens in court.
The problem(s) include Baldwin's constantly changing story. When interrogated by police, the first time, he said that he had extensive experience with firearms. During a second interview, he said that he really didn't know about them.
He claimed he never pulled the trigger, which in a single-action revolver, is impossible to happen without cocking it first.
His comments to police (and press) are inconsistent and at times contradictory. Prosecutor Morrissey will not be kind.
Finally, speaking to mens rea, Baldwin's mind was somewhere else when Hutchins was being airlifted off the set. He was discussing his upcoming vacation with his family. Of course, that's legally irrelevant, but it goes to show you what an a-hole Baldwin is.
wrote on 16 Apr 2024, 01:22 last edited by Doctor Phibes@George-K said in Alec Baldwin Charged:
The problem(s) include Baldwin's constantly changing story.
Yeah, he certainly doesn't appear to be the brightest bulb, and it's no real surprise that he's an asshole. God forbid, but if this should ever happen to me I'd be letting my lawyer do all the talking.
