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The New Coffee Room

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  3. Hay Bach! AAA!

Hay Bach! AAA!

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  • George KG Offline
    George KG Offline
    George K
    wrote on last edited by
    #1

    "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

    The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

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    • KlausK Online
      KlausK Online
      Klaus
      wrote on last edited by
      #2

      Which body part are we looking at, exactly? I assume the first A stands for abdomen?

      My wife always says that if she has to die she'd prefer a ruptured AA.

      1 Reply Last reply
      • George KG Offline
        George KG Offline
        George K
        wrote on last edited by George K
        #3

        It is an abdominal aortic aneurysm.

        I've seen dozens and dozens of these suckers, but never this large. Usually they're less than 10 cm in diameter. If I recall, anything over 5 cm needs following, and if it grows, intervention is recommended.

        My wife always says that if she has to die she'd prefer a ruptured AA.

        No. Just no. Very painful death for a while as your abdomen fills with blood, breathing becomes difficult, and you go into shock.

        If you recall, about 10 - 14 years ago I posted the saga of a ruptured AAA that I took care of in the middle of the night. ("The first number is ...." thread.)

        If you survive surgical intervention for a ruptured AAA, your post-op course will be rocky and difficult with all kinds of complications lurking to kill you (heart attack, renal failure, stroke...).

        Fortunately, in the last 10 years, "Endovascular" repair of AAA has become commonplace. Rather than a stem to stern abdominal incision, smaller incisions are made in the groins, through which introducers are placed which allow the surgeon/radiologist to place a large stent inside the aorta. The stent supports the aorta, preventing it from expanding.

        Basic physics of wall-tension, pressure and radius come into play. The relationship between pressure and tension is linear (obviously, the more blood pressure, the more tension on the arterial wall. However, the relationship between tension and radius is deadly. IOW, at a constant pressure, the increase of diameter of the blood vessel causes an increase in wall tension, until the vessel ruptures.

        "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

        The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

        KlausK 1 Reply Last reply
        • George KG George K

          It is an abdominal aortic aneurysm.

          I've seen dozens and dozens of these suckers, but never this large. Usually they're less than 10 cm in diameter. If I recall, anything over 5 cm needs following, and if it grows, intervention is recommended.

          My wife always says that if she has to die she'd prefer a ruptured AA.

          No. Just no. Very painful death for a while as your abdomen fills with blood, breathing becomes difficult, and you go into shock.

          If you recall, about 10 - 14 years ago I posted the saga of a ruptured AAA that I took care of in the middle of the night. ("The first number is ...." thread.)

          If you survive surgical intervention for a ruptured AAA, your post-op course will be rocky and difficult with all kinds of complications lurking to kill you (heart attack, renal failure, stroke...).

          Fortunately, in the last 10 years, "Endovascular" repair of AAA has become commonplace. Rather than a stem to stern abdominal incision, smaller incisions are made in the groins, through which introducers are placed which allow the surgeon/radiologist to place a large stent inside the aorta. The stent supports the aorta, preventing it from expanding.

          Basic physics of wall-tension, pressure and radius come into play. The relationship between pressure and tension is linear (obviously, the more blood pressure, the more tension on the arterial wall. However, the relationship between tension and radius is deadly. IOW, at a constant pressure, the increase of diameter of the blood vessel causes an increase in wall tension, until the vessel ruptures.

          KlausK Online
          KlausK Online
          Klaus
          wrote on last edited by Klaus
          #4

          @George-K said in Hay Bach! AAA!:

          No. Just no. Very painful death for a while as your abdomen fills with blood, breathing becomes difficult, and you go into shock.

          Hm, I think what she means is not an AAA but an aortic rupture which, according to her, usually leads to loss of consciousness and then death within seconds. Maybe I got that wrong...

          If you had to choose a way to leave earth, what would you choose? What's the top three medial situations that result in quick, painless death?

          George KG 1 Reply Last reply
          • KlausK Klaus

            @George-K said in Hay Bach! AAA!:

            No. Just no. Very painful death for a while as your abdomen fills with blood, breathing becomes difficult, and you go into shock.

            Hm, I think what she means is not an AAA but an aortic rupture which, according to her, usually leads to loss of consciousness and then death within seconds. Maybe I got that wrong...

            If you had to choose a way to leave earth, what would you choose? What's the top three medial situations that result in quick, painless death?

            George KG Offline
            George KG Offline
            George K
            wrote on last edited by
            #5

            @Klaus yeah, I got that. I've seen many ruptured AAAs. THe mortality is, of course, high.

            None of these people looked "peaceful" or "painless." And death is not in a matter of seconds. Usually many minutes, if not an hour. The aorta is (this gets geeky here) a retroperitoneal structure. Free rupture into the abdominal cavity is not the most common presentation. Usually it's a rupture into the retroperitoneal space, with blood tracking cephalad and caudad along the muscle planes. This is why it frequently presents with back pain.

            If I had to choose? I would have a massive stroke - while asleep - for the way to go.

            "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

            The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

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