Skip to content
  • Categories
  • Recent
  • Tags
  • Popular
  • Users
  • Groups
Skins
  • Light
  • Brite
  • Cerulean
  • Cosmo
  • Flatly
  • Journal
  • Litera
  • Lumen
  • Lux
  • Materia
  • Minty
  • Morph
  • Pulse
  • Sandstone
  • Simplex
  • Sketchy
  • Spacelab
  • United
  • Yeti
  • Zephyr
  • Dark
  • Cyborg
  • Darkly
  • Quartz
  • Slate
  • Solar
  • Superhero
  • Vapor

  • Default (No Skin)
  • No Skin
Collapse

The New Coffee Room

  1. TNCR
  2. General Discussion
  3. The Ukraine war thread

The Ukraine war thread

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved General Discussion
3.0k Posts 28 Posters 524.8k Views 2 Watching
  • Oldest to Newest
  • Newest to Oldest
  • Most Votes
Reply
  • Reply as topic
Log in to reply
This topic has been deleted. Only users with topic management privileges can see it.
  • W Wim

    Putin's power bloc cracking?

    https://www.kyivpost.com/videos/64394

    RenaudaR Offline
    RenaudaR Offline
    Renauda
    wrote last edited by Renauda
    #2998

    @Wim

    Makes sense in so far as Russia is not and never has been a monolith state. It also explains the internal struggle since the dissolution of the USSR between the siloviki (strongmen - security services, military) and the financial/industrial business elites. He correctly identifies Rosneft’s Igor Sechin as more than just associated with the FSB. Back in the 90’s Rosneft was the poor boy in the oil patch a badly managed state owned oil company that could not compete with its privatized competition like LUKOil or Surgutneftegaz. That all changed with the arrival of Putin in the Kremlin and during the course of his first two terms Rosneft came to be among the top three Russian oil companies. By now it is probably the most powerful in the country as in terms of production, refining capacity and lucrative financial assets outside of the oil business internally and abroad.

    Elbows up!

    1 Reply Last reply
    • MikM Offline
      MikM Offline
      Mik
      wrote last edited by Mik
      #2999

      Not a cheery article. I can't help but wonder where we would be if the west had supported Ukraine more whole-heartedly. All for using the frozen Russian assets.

      https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/zelensky-is-losing-touch-with-reality/ar-AA1QGvyu

      "You cannot subsidize irresponsibility and expect people to become more responsible." — Thomas Sowell

      RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
      • MikM Mik

        Not a cheery article. I can't help but wonder where we would be if the west had supported Ukraine more whole-heartedly. All for using the frozen Russian assets.

        https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/zelensky-is-losing-touch-with-reality/ar-AA1QGvyu

        RenaudaR Offline
        RenaudaR Offline
        Renauda
        wrote last edited by
        #3000

        @Mik

        Not cheery but as one observer I read pointed out:

        To be clear, the fact Ukraine’s investigators — and its raucous free press — are absolutely going to town on elites is itself evidence of a living, breathing (if coughing) democracy worth defending. One need only glance over the border to recall the alternative.

        Can anyone send us the link to Russia’s credible investigation after the Panama Papers exposed Putin’s billions? Or how his best friend (Roldugin) earned billions playing a cello? (dude must be awesome). Or why the guy who made a two-hour documentary on Putin’s $1.4 billion Black Sea mega-palace ended up dead in a Putin prison?

        The absence of scandal in an autocracy is often just a symptom of its silent, dehumanising condition. And inversely (if uncomfortably), the presence of scandal in a democracy often just reflects the messy but sacred human agency underneath. And that’s worth fighting for, everywhere, every time.

        Elbows up!

        1 Reply Last reply
        • MikM Offline
          MikM Offline
          Mik
          wrote last edited by
          #3001

          Good observation.

          "You cannot subsidize irresponsibility and expect people to become more responsible." — Thomas Sowell

          RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
          • MikM Mik

            Good observation.

            RenaudaR Offline
            RenaudaR Offline
            Renauda
            wrote last edited by
            #3002

            @Mik

            I thought so as well.

            I’m the meantime, I have nothing to say about the past 24 hrs of hearsay surrounding Moscow’s and Dim Philby’s (Witkoff the dummkopf) latest terms of unconditional surrender being laid out before the embattled Ukrainian nation.

            Elbows up!

            1 Reply Last reply
            • MikM Offline
              MikM Offline
              Mik
              wrote last edited by
              #3003

              Oh, the cash for land, but you really still own it? Absurd to the point of surreal.

              "You cannot subsidize irresponsibility and expect people to become more responsible." — Thomas Sowell

              1 Reply Last reply
              • RenaudaR Offline
                RenaudaR Offline
                Renauda
                wrote last edited by Renauda
                #3004

                Surreal is right. I really cannot comprehend how the US could even table the alleged terms for the Ukranians’ consideration.

                Elbows up!

                1 Reply Last reply
                • MikM Offline
                  MikM Offline
                  Mik
                  wrote last edited by
                  #3005

                  He's just throwing shit against the wall to see if anything sticks.

                  "You cannot subsidize irresponsibility and expect people to become more responsible." — Thomas Sowell

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  • RenaudaR Offline
                    RenaudaR Offline
                    Renauda
                    wrote last edited by Renauda
                    #3006

                    I don’t believe that for a minute. War diplomacy is not a jam session to see what sticks to the wall.

                    Elbows up!

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • MikM Offline
                      MikM Offline
                      Mik
                      wrote last edited by Mik
                      #3007

                      Normally, no, it isn't. but we're pretty short on normal here. I don't think Trump can conceive of someone NOT wanting to make a deal.

                      "You cannot subsidize irresponsibility and expect people to become more responsible." — Thomas Sowell

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      • RenaudaR Offline
                        RenaudaR Offline
                        Renauda
                        wrote last edited by Renauda
                        #3008

                        You may be right… after all, Trump still thinks Putin is his trusted friend. 🙄

                        Elbows up!

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        • MikM Offline
                          MikM Offline
                          Mik
                          wrote last edited by
                          #3009

                          I don’t think he believes it, he just tries to sell it. With normal humans it may have value, but Putin is not by any means a normal human.

                          "You cannot subsidize irresponsibility and expect people to become more responsible." — Thomas Sowell

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          • RenaudaR Offline
                            RenaudaR Offline
                            Renauda
                            wrote last edited by
                            #3010

                            While he’s trying to sell it (or something to whom, no one knows for certain), Putin is slowly drowning him in a spoonful of water.

                            Elbows up!

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            • MikM Offline
                              MikM Offline
                              Mik
                              wrote last edited by
                              #3011

                              Indeed. Why should he quit? He still has at least a tenuous hold on Russia and in a war of attrition he will probably win. Not a bad approach if you don't care how many Russians you lose.

                              "You cannot subsidize irresponsibility and expect people to become more responsible." — Thomas Sowell

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              • RenaudaR Offline
                                RenaudaR Offline
                                Renauda
                                wrote last edited by
                                #3012

                                With Putin, it is never about the mass expenditure of human capital. In fact I am sure he adheres religiously to Stalin’s alleged quote:

                                "A single death is a tragedy; a million deaths is a statistic.”

                                Elbows up!

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                • MikM Offline
                                  MikM Offline
                                  Mik
                                  wrote last edited by
                                  #3013

                                  Those who forget history....

                                  (applies to all parties)

                                  "You cannot subsidize irresponsibility and expect people to become more responsible." — Thomas Sowell

                                  1 Reply Last reply
                                  • AxtremusA Away
                                    AxtremusA Away
                                    Axtremus
                                    wrote last edited by
                                    #3014

                                    https://www.nytimes.com/2025/11/21/world/europe/ukraine-russia-us-peace-plan.html?unlocked_article_code=1.208.qP_m.hyCR3PeKDQ8T

                                    The 28-point proposal [from the USA] favors Russia in pivotal aspects, including requiring Ukraine to cede territory and cap the size of its postwar army, while offering financial and geopolitical incentives to Moscow.

                                    @Renauda ... your thoughts?

                                    RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
                                    • MikM Offline
                                      MikM Offline
                                      Mik
                                      wrote last edited by
                                      #3015

                                      It’s delusional.

                                      "You cannot subsidize irresponsibility and expect people to become more responsible." — Thomas Sowell

                                      W 1 Reply Last reply
                                      • MikM Mik

                                        It’s delusional.

                                        W Offline
                                        W Offline
                                        Wim
                                        wrote last edited by
                                        #3016

                                        @Mik Sheer madness.

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        • AxtremusA Axtremus

                                          https://www.nytimes.com/2025/11/21/world/europe/ukraine-russia-us-peace-plan.html?unlocked_article_code=1.208.qP_m.hyCR3PeKDQ8T

                                          The 28-point proposal [from the USA] favors Russia in pivotal aspects, including requiring Ukraine to cede territory and cap the size of its postwar army, while offering financial and geopolitical incentives to Moscow.

                                          @Renauda ... your thoughts?

                                          RenaudaR Offline
                                          RenaudaR Offline
                                          Renauda
                                          wrote last edited by Renauda
                                          #3017

                                          @Axtremus said in The Ukraine war thread:

                                          https://www.nytimes.com/2025/11/21/world/europe/ukraine-russia-us-peace-plan.html?unlocked_article_code=1.208.qP_m.hyCR3PeKDQ8T

                                          The 28-point proposal [from the USA] favors Russia in pivotal aspects, including requiring Ukraine to cede territory and cap the size of its postwar army, while offering financial and geopolitical incentives to Moscow.

                                          @Renauda ... your thoughts?

                                          I don’t think there’s much in it that I didn’t already anticipate in one form or another. It certainly rewards Putin’s unprovoked aggression of the past eleven years against Ukraine. It also gives Putin the time and opportunity he needs in order to finish off the country once and for all at a future date of his choosing. Think of it as a 21 century version of the Ribbentrop Molotov pact. It is not a lasting or just peace for Ukraine but rather a temporary non aggression pact between Russia and the US. It is nothing more than an armistice on Moscow’s maximalist terms that no one outside of the Kremlin or the Oval Office can like or trust.

                                          In the meantime, here is a link to Lawrence Friedman’s excellent analysis of what we know:

                                          https://open.substack.com/pub/samf/p/the-witkoff-dmitriev-peace-plan-annotated?utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email

                                          Elbows up!

                                          1 Reply Last reply
                                          Reply
                                          • Reply as topic
                                          Log in to reply
                                          • Oldest to Newest
                                          • Newest to Oldest
                                          • Most Votes


                                          • Login

                                          • Don't have an account? Register

                                          • Login or register to search.
                                          • First post
                                            Last post
                                          0
                                          • Categories
                                          • Recent
                                          • Tags
                                          • Popular
                                          • Users
                                          • Groups