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The New Coffee Room

  1. TNCR
  2. General Discussion
  3. Nukes?

Nukes?

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  • JollyJ Jolly

    Ain't gonna happen.

    Doctor PhibesD Offline
    Doctor PhibesD Offline
    Doctor Phibes
    wrote on last edited by
    #9

    @Jolly said in Nukes?:

    Ain't gonna happen.

    Let's hope not. A lot of people said that about the invasion.

    I was only joking

    1 Reply Last reply
    • JollyJ Offline
      JollyJ Offline
      Jolly
      wrote on last edited by
      #10

      Different critter.

      You. Him. Her. Anybody. If a nuke gets popped off, all Hell breaks loose. Now. And in living color.

      Ain't gonna happen.

      “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

      Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

      1 Reply Last reply
      • JollyJ Offline
        JollyJ Offline
        Jolly
        wrote on last edited by Jolly
        #11

        During the Cuban Missile Crisis, the U.S. had already determined that if the conflict went nuclear, there would be no nation on the face of the earth with any nuclear capability that was hostile to the U.S. would be left standing.

        Nobody.

        That was the policy then. I wouldn't bet against it still being the policy.

        “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

        Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

        1 Reply Last reply
        • RenaudaR Offline
          RenaudaR Offline
          Renauda
          wrote on last edited by Renauda
          #12

          Jolly is correct on all points. Once the nuclear threshold is crossed there is no backing down the ladder.

          Elbows up!

          CopperC 1 Reply Last reply
          • RenaudaR Renauda

            Jolly is correct on all points. Once the nuclear threshold is crossed there is no backing down the ladder.

            CopperC Offline
            CopperC Offline
            Copper
            wrote on last edited by Copper
            #13

            There are nukes and then there are nukes.

            There are cute little battlefield nukes, no big deal

            4bf08042-3b41-463a-993f-0d23c7a19dec-image.png

            And then there is the giant economy size

            b6517319-bdf9-4943-9793-5d729865b014-image.png

            I assume we are talking about big nukes.

            Big nukes attached to ICBMs

            1 Reply Last reply
            • KlausK Offline
              KlausK Offline
              Klaus
              wrote on last edited by
              #14

              I really do wonder what would happen if Putin would use a small tactical nuke.

              Would the US then really send all their big nukes, and wait for the mutually assured destruction?

              There is certainly a very real danger that things would escalate to that level, but I don't think it's a given.

              jon-nycJ 2 Replies Last reply
              • KlausK Klaus

                I really do wonder what would happen if Putin would use a small tactical nuke.

                Would the US then really send all their big nukes, and wait for the mutually assured destruction?

                There is certainly a very real danger that things would escalate to that level, but I don't think it's a given.

                jon-nycJ Offline
                jon-nycJ Offline
                jon-nyc
                wrote on last edited by jon-nyc
                #15

                @Klaus No way would that kind of escalation occur just from a battlefield nuke in Ukraine. I think if they used a nuclear bomb the support to isolate them completely, which is very high already in the west, would go off the charts.

                I think the real risk of major escalation would be if he tried this with the Baltics, since they're Nato states. I suspect his plan has been to wait to see if Trump returns before trying that, since Trump already publicly caved on Article 5.

                "You never know what worse luck your bad luck has saved you from."
                -Cormac McCarthy

                1 Reply Last reply
                • MikM Offline
                  MikM Offline
                  Mik
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #16

                  China and India would turn on them then.

                  “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  • KlausK Klaus

                    I really do wonder what would happen if Putin would use a small tactical nuke.

                    Would the US then really send all their big nukes, and wait for the mutually assured destruction?

                    There is certainly a very real danger that things would escalate to that level, but I don't think it's a given.

                    jon-nycJ Offline
                    jon-nycJ Offline
                    jon-nyc
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #17

                    @Klaus said in Nukes?:

                    I really do wonder what would happen if Putin would use a small tactical nuke.

                    Would the US then really send all their big nukes, and wait for the mutually assured destruction?

                    There is certainly a very real danger that things would escalate to that level, but I don't think it's a given.

                    I think it's instructive that when Putin went to nuclear high alert, the President chose not to meet him (going to DefCon 3) but rather had his people out saying that once again Putin is manufacturing a menace.

                    "You never know what worse luck your bad luck has saved you from."
                    -Cormac McCarthy

                    George KG 1 Reply Last reply
                    • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

                      @Klaus said in Nukes?:

                      I really do wonder what would happen if Putin would use a small tactical nuke.

                      Would the US then really send all their big nukes, and wait for the mutually assured destruction?

                      There is certainly a very real danger that things would escalate to that level, but I don't think it's a given.

                      I think it's instructive that when Putin went to nuclear high alert, the President chose not to meet him (going to DefCon 3) but rather had his people out saying that once again Putin is manufacturing a menace.

                      George KG Offline
                      George KG Offline
                      George K
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #18

                      @jon-nyc said in Nukes?:

                      I think it's instructive that when Putin went to nuclear high alert, the President chose not to meet him (going to DefCon 3) but rather had his people out saying that once again Putin is manufacturing a menace.

                      Another likely explanation is that Zelensky's had a target on his back since day one, and showing up would present a security hazard.

                      (I assume you're talking about the meeting near Belarus today)

                      "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                      The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      • jon-nycJ Offline
                        jon-nycJ Offline
                        jon-nyc
                        wrote on last edited by jon-nyc
                        #19

                        No - I’m referring to Jolly’s our President. Normally if Russia were to go on high alert the option to call him (in the poker sense) would be defcon 3. We didn’t do that.

                        "You never know what worse luck your bad luck has saved you from."
                        -Cormac McCarthy

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        • JollyJ Offline
                          JollyJ Offline
                          Jolly
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #20

                          Our President is in Delaware, taking a nap in his La-z-boy.

                          “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                          Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          • KlausK Offline
                            KlausK Offline
                            Klaus
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #21

                            What if Putin would issue an ultimatum of the form "Either you accept defeat, or I'll level Kiev with nukes"? I think it's not entirely impossible that this happens if the war goes south for Russia and Putin feels cornered.

                            ImprovisoI Aqua LetiferA 2 Replies Last reply
                            • George KG Offline
                              George KG Offline
                              George K
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #22

                              https://olxpraca.com/ukraine-nuclear-weapons-russia-invasion/

                              The tragedy now unfolding in Ukraine highlights a broader principle that is clearly visible around the world: countries that sacrifice their nuclear deterrent in exchange for promises of international goodwill often sign their own death warrant. In a world teeming with weapons capable of destroying human civilization, nonproliferation is itself a morally worthwhile and even necessary goal. But the experience of countries that have actually disarmed is likely to lead many of them to come to a different conclusion in the future.

                              The betrayal of the Ukrainians, in particular, cannot be underestimated. In 1994, the government of Ukraine signed a memorandum according to which the country joined the global Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons, formally renouncing the status of a nuclear power. The text of this agreement stated that in exchange for this move, “the Russian Federation, the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland and the United States of America reaffirm their commitment to refrain from the threat or use of force against the territorial integrity or political independence of Ukraine.”

                              Since then, the territorial integrity of Ukraine has not been respected. After Russia’s annexation of the Ukrainian territory of Crimea in 2014, which did not provoke a serious international reaction, Ukrainian leaders have already thought twice about the merits of the agreement they signed just two decades ago. Today they sound positively bitter about it.

                              "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                              The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              • KlausK Klaus

                                What if Putin would issue an ultimatum of the form "Either you accept defeat, or I'll level Kiev with nukes"? I think it's not entirely impossible that this happens if the war goes south for Russia and Putin feels cornered.

                                ImprovisoI Offline
                                ImprovisoI Offline
                                Improviso
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #23

                                @Klaus said in Nukes?:

                                What if Putin would issue an ultimatum of the form "Either you accept defeat, or I'll level Kiev with nukes"? I think it's not entirely impossible that this happens if the war goes south for Russia and Putin feels cornered.

                                History will record that as the official date that WW3 started.

                                It won't be Biden to lead that. He will follow after someone else pulls the trigger on Putin.

                                We have the freedom to choose our actions, but we do not get to choose our consequences.
                                Yes, there are two paths you can go by, but in the long run, there's still time to change the road you're on.

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                • KlausK Klaus

                                  What if Putin would issue an ultimatum of the form "Either you accept defeat, or I'll level Kiev with nukes"? I think it's not entirely impossible that this happens if the war goes south for Russia and Putin feels cornered.

                                  Aqua LetiferA Offline
                                  Aqua LetiferA Offline
                                  Aqua Letifer
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #24

                                  @Klaus said in Nukes?:

                                  What if Putin would issue an ultimatum of the form "Either you accept defeat, or I'll level Kiev with nukes"? I think it's not entirely impossible that this happens if the war goes south for Russia and Putin feels cornered.

                                  That's what I think might happen today.

                                  Please love yourself.

                                  1 Reply Last reply
                                  • Doctor PhibesD Offline
                                    Doctor PhibesD Offline
                                    Doctor Phibes
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #25

                                    I wonder what are the chances of somebody in Russia doing something about VP?

                                    I was only joking

                                    jodiJ 1 Reply Last reply
                                    • Doctor PhibesD Doctor Phibes

                                      I wonder what are the chances of somebody in Russia doing something about VP?

                                      jodiJ Offline
                                      jodiJ Offline
                                      jodi
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #26

                                      @Doctor-Phibes said in Nukes?:

                                      I wonder what are the chances of somebody in Russia doing something about VP?

                                      That’s what I’ve been wondering.

                                      1 Reply Last reply
                                      • KlausK Offline
                                        KlausK Offline
                                        Klaus
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #27

                                        VP?

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        • JollyJ Offline
                                          JollyJ Offline
                                          Jolly
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #28

                                          Putin.

                                          “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                                          Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

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