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The New Coffee Room

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  3. Murder by Air Embolism

Murder by Air Embolism

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  • George KG Offline
    George KG Offline
    George K
    wrote on last edited by
    #1

    https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/texas-nurse-convicted-killing-4-men-air-injections-rcna3380

    A Texas nurse was convicted Tuesday of capital murder in the deaths of four patients who died after prosecutors say he injected them with air following heart surgeries.

    The Smith County jury deliberated for about an hour before finding William George Davis, of Hallsville, guilty of capital murder involving multiple victims. Prosecutors planned to seek the death penalty during the sentencing phase, which was scheduled to start Wednesday.

    Davis, 37, was accused of injecting air into the four patients’ arteries after they underwent heart surgery at the Christus Trinity Mother Frances Hospital in Tyler in 2017 and 2018. During recovery from their surgeries, the four — John Lafferty, Ronald Clark, Christopher Greenway and Joseph Kalina — suffered unexplained neurological problems and died.

    During the trial, Dr. William Yarbrough, a Dallas-area pulmonologist and professor of internal medicine, explained to the jury how injecting air into the arterial system of the brain causes brain injury and death.

    Yarbrough said he was able to determine there was air in the arterial system of the victims’ brains by viewing images from brain scans — something he said he had never before observed in his decades in medicine.

    "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

    The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

    1 Reply Last reply
    • KlausK Online
      KlausK Online
      Klaus
      wrote on last edited by
      #2

      One common bike maintenance pitfall is to have air in the hydraulic disc brake system. Devastating consequences for braking performance.

      Aqua LetiferA 1 Reply Last reply
      • KlausK Klaus

        One common bike maintenance pitfall is to have air in the hydraulic disc brake system. Devastating consequences for braking performance.

        Aqua LetiferA Offline
        Aqua LetiferA Offline
        Aqua Letifer
        wrote on last edited by Aqua Letifer
        #3

        @klaus said in Murder by Air Embolism:

        One common bike maintenance pitfall is to have air in the hydraulic disc brake system. Devastating consequences for braking performance.

        Gotta spike that shit properly! Or just use rim brakes and stop being such a fucking Nancy.

        Please love yourself.

        KlausK 1 Reply Last reply
        • George KG Offline
          George KG Offline
          George K
          wrote on last edited by
          #4

          It take a lot, and I mean A LOT of air to kill someone if you inject it intravenously. Injecting into a peripheral vein is usually inconsequential. The air dissolves in the blood and nothing happens.

          Now, if you inject a large volume (several milliliters per kilogram), you can cause a lethal air embolism. It has to be injected rapidly, and the mechanism of death is obstruction of right ventricular outflow by the air bolus.

          https://pubs.asahq.org/anesthesiology/article/94/2/360/38886/Volume-of-Air-in-a-Lethal-Venous-Air-Embolism

          I've seen several hemodynamically-significant venous air embolisms, and if recognized, it's usually a minor hiccup. I can only assume they were relatively small.

          But, these are venous air embolisms.

          An embolism on the arterial side, however, is a much bigger deal. It's something that we always took care to prevent during heart surgery - after all, you're opening the aorta and there's always a potential for air to get into the system. Shooting air into the aorta as it leaves the heart is a setup for air getting into the cerebral circulation, causing stroke, or worse.

          I'd really like to see the story of how this guy did what he did. The article says that air was seen on the CT scans of the patients' heads. As the neurologist says, that indicates that it was an arterial air embolism.

          "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

          The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

          RenaudaR Catseye3C 2 Replies Last reply
          • markM Offline
            markM Offline
            mark
            wrote on last edited by
            #5

            What a monster.

            1 Reply Last reply
            • JollyJ Offline
              JollyJ Offline
              Jolly
              wrote on last edited by
              #6

              Thank God Texas has the Death Penalty.

              I hope they move him to the express lane.

              “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

              Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

              1 Reply Last reply
              • Aqua LetiferA Aqua Letifer

                @klaus said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                One common bike maintenance pitfall is to have air in the hydraulic disc brake system. Devastating consequences for braking performance.

                Gotta spike that shit properly! Or just use rim brakes and stop being such a fucking Nancy.

                KlausK Online
                KlausK Online
                Klaus
                wrote on last edited by
                #7

                @aqua-letifer said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                @klaus said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                One common bike maintenance pitfall is to have air in the hydraulic disc brake system. Devastating consequences for braking performance.

                Gotta spike that shit properly! Or just use rim brakes and stop being such a fucking Nancy.

                I do like a good pair of rim brakes - especially how easy they are to maintain - but their time is over.

                Aqua LetiferA 1 Reply Last reply
                • George KG George K

                  It take a lot, and I mean A LOT of air to kill someone if you inject it intravenously. Injecting into a peripheral vein is usually inconsequential. The air dissolves in the blood and nothing happens.

                  Now, if you inject a large volume (several milliliters per kilogram), you can cause a lethal air embolism. It has to be injected rapidly, and the mechanism of death is obstruction of right ventricular outflow by the air bolus.

                  https://pubs.asahq.org/anesthesiology/article/94/2/360/38886/Volume-of-Air-in-a-Lethal-Venous-Air-Embolism

                  I've seen several hemodynamically-significant venous air embolisms, and if recognized, it's usually a minor hiccup. I can only assume they were relatively small.

                  But, these are venous air embolisms.

                  An embolism on the arterial side, however, is a much bigger deal. It's something that we always took care to prevent during heart surgery - after all, you're opening the aorta and there's always a potential for air to get into the system. Shooting air into the aorta as it leaves the heart is a setup for air getting into the cerebral circulation, causing stroke, or worse.

                  I'd really like to see the story of how this guy did what he did. The article says that air was seen on the CT scans of the patients' heads. As the neurologist says, that indicates that it was an arterial air embolism.

                  RenaudaR Offline
                  RenaudaR Offline
                  Renauda
                  wrote on last edited by Renauda
                  #8

                  @george-k

                  The safety sign on the machine shop floor warned that compressed air kills. Never have exposed skin to a direct shot of compressed air.

                  Elbows up!

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  • George KG George K

                    It take a lot, and I mean A LOT of air to kill someone if you inject it intravenously. Injecting into a peripheral vein is usually inconsequential. The air dissolves in the blood and nothing happens.

                    Now, if you inject a large volume (several milliliters per kilogram), you can cause a lethal air embolism. It has to be injected rapidly, and the mechanism of death is obstruction of right ventricular outflow by the air bolus.

                    https://pubs.asahq.org/anesthesiology/article/94/2/360/38886/Volume-of-Air-in-a-Lethal-Venous-Air-Embolism

                    I've seen several hemodynamically-significant venous air embolisms, and if recognized, it's usually a minor hiccup. I can only assume they were relatively small.

                    But, these are venous air embolisms.

                    An embolism on the arterial side, however, is a much bigger deal. It's something that we always took care to prevent during heart surgery - after all, you're opening the aorta and there's always a potential for air to get into the system. Shooting air into the aorta as it leaves the heart is a setup for air getting into the cerebral circulation, causing stroke, or worse.

                    I'd really like to see the story of how this guy did what he did. The article says that air was seen on the CT scans of the patients' heads. As the neurologist says, that indicates that it was an arterial air embolism.

                    Catseye3C Offline
                    Catseye3C Offline
                    Catseye3
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #9

                    @george-k said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                    It take a lot, and I mean A LOT of air to kill someone if you inject it intravenously.

                    It had a good run as a creative and diabolical means of murder in mystery novels though, until autopsies got all fancy with their pinprick detection techniques and whatnot. Readers wised up.

                    Success is measured by your discipline and inner peace. – Mike Ditka

                    JollyJ 1 Reply Last reply
                    • KlausK Klaus

                      @aqua-letifer said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                      @klaus said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                      One common bike maintenance pitfall is to have air in the hydraulic disc brake system. Devastating consequences for braking performance.

                      Gotta spike that shit properly! Or just use rim brakes and stop being such a fucking Nancy.

                      I do like a good pair of rim brakes - especially how easy they are to maintain - but their time is over.

                      Aqua LetiferA Offline
                      Aqua LetiferA Offline
                      Aqua Letifer
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #10

                      @klaus said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                      @aqua-letifer said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                      @klaus said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                      One common bike maintenance pitfall is to have air in the hydraulic disc brake system. Devastating consequences for braking performance.

                      Gotta spike that shit properly! Or just use rim brakes and stop being such a fucking Nancy.

                      I do like a good pair of rim brakes - especially how easy they are to maintain - but their time is over.

                      Pffffffffffft.

                      Please love yourself.

                      Doctor PhibesD 1 Reply Last reply
                      • Catseye3C Catseye3

                        @george-k said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                        It take a lot, and I mean A LOT of air to kill someone if you inject it intravenously.

                        It had a good run as a creative and diabolical means of murder in mystery novels though, until autopsies got all fancy with their pinprick detection techniques and whatnot. Readers wised up.

                        JollyJ Offline
                        JollyJ Offline
                        Jolly
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #11

                        @catseye3 said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                        @george-k said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                        It take a lot, and I mean A LOT of air to kill someone if you inject it intravenously.

                        It had a good run as a creative and diabolical means of murder in mystery novels though, until autopsies got all fancy with their pinprick detection techniques and whatnot. Readers wised up.

                        Depends on the victim. In the old days, we posted a lot more patients. And anybody that died outside of the hospital was most often posted, unless they were old with known health problems. Today, not so much.

                        Unless foul play is suspected or there are legal aspects, most outpatients are never autopsied. Those are usually forensic, if they are done. And very, very few inpatients are posted.

                        “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                        Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                        Catseye3C 1 Reply Last reply
                        • Aqua LetiferA Aqua Letifer

                          @klaus said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                          @aqua-letifer said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                          @klaus said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                          One common bike maintenance pitfall is to have air in the hydraulic disc brake system. Devastating consequences for braking performance.

                          Gotta spike that shit properly! Or just use rim brakes and stop being such a fucking Nancy.

                          I do like a good pair of rim brakes - especially how easy they are to maintain - but their time is over.

                          Pffffffffffft.

                          Doctor PhibesD Online
                          Doctor PhibesD Online
                          Doctor Phibes
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #12

                          @aqua-letifer said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                          Pffffffffffft.

                          Funnily enough, that's exactly the noise his fancy-schmancy brakes will make after they've leaked all over the shop and he attempts to apply them just before a high speed meeting with Destiny.

                          I was only joking

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          • JollyJ Jolly

                            @catseye3 said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                            @george-k said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                            It take a lot, and I mean A LOT of air to kill someone if you inject it intravenously.

                            It had a good run as a creative and diabolical means of murder in mystery novels though, until autopsies got all fancy with their pinprick detection techniques and whatnot. Readers wised up.

                            Depends on the victim. In the old days, we posted a lot more patients. And anybody that died outside of the hospital was most often posted, unless they were old with known health problems. Today, not so much.

                            Unless foul play is suspected or there are legal aspects, most outpatients are never autopsied. Those are usually forensic, if they are done. And very, very few inpatients are posted.

                            Catseye3C Offline
                            Catseye3C Offline
                            Catseye3
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #13

                            @jolly said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                            Depends on the victim. In the old days, we posted a lot more patients.

                            Talking about fiction.

                            Success is measured by your discipline and inner peace. – Mike Ditka

                            JollyJ 1 Reply Last reply
                            • Catseye3C Catseye3

                              @jolly said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                              Depends on the victim. In the old days, we posted a lot more patients.

                              Talking about fiction.

                              JollyJ Offline
                              JollyJ Offline
                              Jolly
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #14

                              @catseye3 said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                              @jolly said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                              Depends on the victim. In the old days, we posted a lot more patients.

                              Talking about fiction.

                              Ok, I'll bite.

                              What do you know about autopsies?

                              “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                              Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                              Catseye3C 1 Reply Last reply
                              • JollyJ Jolly

                                @catseye3 said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                                @jolly said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                                Depends on the victim. In the old days, we posted a lot more patients.

                                Talking about fiction.

                                Ok, I'll bite.

                                What do you know about autopsies?

                                Catseye3C Offline
                                Catseye3C Offline
                                Catseye3
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #15

                                @jolly said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                                What do you know about autopsies?

                                I don't have to know about autopsies. I made an observation about the use of injecting air as a murder device in mystery novels. That's it.

                                Success is measured by your discipline and inner peace. – Mike Ditka

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                • AxtremusA Offline
                                  AxtremusA Offline
                                  Axtremus
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #16

                                  What does it feel like to be killed by an air embolism?
                                  What are the outward signs that the victim of air embolism would exhibit before he dies of it?

                                  George KG Doctor PhibesD 2 Replies Last reply
                                  • AxtremusA Axtremus

                                    What does it feel like to be killed by an air embolism?
                                    What are the outward signs that the victim of air embolism would exhibit before he dies of it?

                                    George KG Offline
                                    George KG Offline
                                    George K
                                    wrote on last edited by George K
                                    #17

                                    @axtremus said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                                    What does it feel like to be killed by an air embolism?
                                    Venous air embolism? Probably feels like you've had a massive heart attack and your heart stops pumping.

                                    Arterial air embolism? Probably feels like you're having a stroke, if the air goes to the cerebral circulation. Otherwise, I imagine that, if it's large enough, it can cut off circulation to an extremity or other organ. I suppose it depends on how much air is injected, how fast, and where the injection occurs.

                                    What are the outward signs that the victim of air embolism would exhibit before he dies of it?

                                    Cardiovascular collapse or stroke, depending on the type of embolism.

                                    "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                                    The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    • AxtremusA Axtremus

                                      What does it feel like to be killed by an air embolism?
                                      What are the outward signs that the victim of air embolism would exhibit before he dies of it?

                                      Doctor PhibesD Online
                                      Doctor PhibesD Online
                                      Doctor Phibes
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #18

                                      @axtremus said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                                      What does it feel like to be killed by an air embolism?

                                      You will experience a tingling sensation, and then death.

                                      I was only joking

                                      1 Reply Last reply
                                      • CopperC Offline
                                        CopperC Offline
                                        Copper
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #19

                                        @george-k said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                                        Cardiovascular

                                        How good is the heart as an air pump?

                                        RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
                                        • CopperC Copper

                                          @george-k said in Murder by Air Embolism:

                                          Cardiovascular

                                          How good is the heart as an air pump?

                                          RenaudaR Offline
                                          RenaudaR Offline
                                          Renauda
                                          wrote on last edited by Renauda
                                          #20

                                          @Copper

                                          Probably no better than the in line water pump I use to flush my Naivien hot water on demand system with vinegar once a year.

                                          Elbows up!

                                          1 Reply Last reply
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