Don't reform it. End it.

[Larry]

@axtremus said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@doctor-phibes said in Don't reform it. End it.:

I remain unconvinced that a move towards home-schooling is going to help with this. In addition, the move seems to be primarily due to concerns regarding indoctrination rather than academic performance.

Indeed I also notice this. More folks choose to "home school" not because they want their kids to learn more STEM, but because they want their kids to not be exposed to certain things, like "sex ed" and the theory of evolution. In the USA, religious influence seems to play a prominent role in many parents' decisions to "home school."

This is the kind of stupid, ignorant shit that just makes my skin crawl. It is conclusions reached based on ignorant bias, and a view commonly held by self righteous city asswipes that southerners are inferior, home schooling is a religious thing, done with no structure. All three views are not just incorrect, but so utterly incorrect as to affirm the value of home schooling.

Home schooling doesn't need to be put it parenthesis. It is NOT an unstructured, do it yourself willy nilly process that is somehow inferior to public schooling. It is NOT a religious thing. It's true that people of faith are more prone to objecting to their kids being indoctrinated than those with no faith, but that's a huge difference from the way Ax presented it.

Home schooling is done with academic oversight, lesson plans, goals have to be reached, etc.. just like public schools. Sex education and evolution are not omitted, the claim to the contrary being the product of a cripple brained asshat looking down his nose at those hes speaking about.

You need the shit kicked out of you.

[Catseye3]

When I was a young thing living in Germany, the system there split kids into two groups upon their 17th birthday: You proceeded either to academia or toward trade school. I don't know if that system still exists. I'd be surprised if it did. Maybe Klaus can say.

I thought it was a great idea.

Of course, it would never fly here. Parents would scream that their child, who was really brilliant if you got to know him, was being discriminated against blah blah blah. Then after they defeated the proposal, would lapse back into lethargy and preoccupation with other things.

From what little I know of home schooling, I'm all for it. Or at least, all for exploring it further.

[LuFins Dad]

Post 1) Gee, I wonder if I might have something to add to this conversation as a father of a recent grad of Loudoun County Public Schools and the father of a 2-year-old that has to decide between having that child attend school in this district or homeschooling. I also happen to be Christian, but not “out there” so to speak. One who believes in evolution and Sex Ed and thinks both should be taught in schools…

1. LCPS is a tremendous school district. Over a 95% graduation rate and somewhere around 90% of the school graduates well prepared for college. Also, there is extraordinarily low crime rates outside of a 1 mile square in a town called Sterling. I think Aqua used to live there…Like I said, it’s why we live here rather than living in Prince William County with a much nicer house for the money and only a 20 minute longer commute for me for work…

Now here’s the debate, how much of that success is due to this being the wealthiest county in the US? With highly educated and involved parents? I’d say a good bit, but I am also willing to credit the school system.

Now, this school system has had a tremendous amount of success with African American students. They have a HIGHER graduation rate than the 95% average AND African American families median income in the county is above the county’s median income which is the highest in the US.

[Doctor Phibes]

@catseye3 said in Don't reform it. End it.:

When I was a young thing living in Germany, the system there split kids into two groups upon their 17th birthday: You proceeded either to academia or toward trade school. I don't know if that system still exists. I'd be surprised if it did. Maybe Klaus can say.

I thought it was a great idea.

Of course, it would never fly here. Parents would scream that their child, who was really brilliant if you got to know him, was being discriminated against blah blah blah. Then after they defeated the proposal, would lapse back into lethargy and preoccupation with other things.

From what little I know of home schooling, I'm all for it. Or at least, all for exploring it further.

Home schooling is illegal in Germany, as it happens.

[Doctor Phibes]

@lufins-dad said in Don't reform it. End it.:

Post 1) Gee, I wonder if I might have something to add to this conversation as a father of a recent grad of Loudoun County Public Schools and the father of a 2-year-old that has to decide between having that child attend school in this district or homeschooling. I also happen to be Christian, but not “out there” so to speak. One who believes in evolution and Sex Ed and thinks both should be taught in schools…

1. LCPS is a tremendous school district. Over a 95% graduation rate and somewhere around 90% of the school graduates well prepared for college. Also, there is extraordinarily low crime rates outside of a 1 mile square in a town called Sterling. I think Aqua used to live there…Like I said, it’s why we live here rather than living in Prince William County with a much nicer house for the money and only a 20 minute longer commute for me for work…

Now here’s the debate, how much of that success is due to this being the wealthiest county in the US? With highly educated and involved parents? I’d say a good bit, but I am also willing to credit the school system.

Now, this school system has had a tremendous amount of success with African American students. They have a HIGHER graduation rate than the 95% average AND African American families median income in the county is above the county’s median income which is the highest in the US.

We chose where we live based largely due to the reputation of the school system. It's a big deal, and we were very lucky. We essentially chose to live in a considerably smaller house than we could have afforded in other towns in the area so that our kids could go to school here. And now they're fully grown, we're really noticing it.

[Jolly]

Homeschooling runs the gamut from mom at home with one child, to parents banding together to hire a certified teacher (great gig for a retired elementary teacher), to consortiums that combine remote learning with class instruction, especially in subjects like calculus.

This ain't Little House on the Prairie, y'all...

[Doctor Phibes]

@jolly said in Don't reform it. End it.:

This ain't Little House on the Prairie, y'all...

Ms. Ingalls Wilder certainly wrote a lot better than the author of the article you quoted.

I know, unnecessary snark. Still....

[Horace]

It's like nobody attended the same grade schools as I did. Do you think a parent can't provide whatever that was, in terms of information? The teachers at those schools don't depend on their gained knowledge, they depend on text books and lesson plans generated by a community of teachers. What's to stop a parent from relying on those same materials? Are text books impossible to come by? Who on earth thinks your average grade school teacher has some special intelligence about anything other than corralling kids? You still won't find anybody with special intelligence about anything until you're going for a PhD, and then only maybe.

[Doctor Phibes]

@horace said in Don't reform it. End it.:

It's like nobody attended the same grade schools as I did. Do you think a parent can't provide whatever that was, in terms of information? The teachers at those schools don't depend on their gained knowledge, they depend on text books and lesson plans generated by a community of teachers. What's to stop a parent from relying on those same materials? Are text books impossible to come by? Who on earth thinks your average grade school teacher has some special intelligence about anything other than corralling kids? You still won't find anybody with special intelligence about anything until you're going for a PhD, and then only maybe.

Hear speaks the voice of experience.

[Horace]

@doctor-phibes said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@horace said in Don't reform it. End it.:

It's like nobody attended the same grade schools as I did. Do you think a parent can't provide whatever that was, in terms of information? The teachers at those schools don't depend on their gained knowledge, they depend on text books and lesson plans generated by a community of teachers. What's to stop a parent from relying on those same materials? Are text books impossible to come by? Who on earth thinks your average grade school teacher has some special intelligence about anything other than corralling kids? You still won't find anybody with special intelligence about anything until you're going for a PhD, and then only maybe.

Here speaks the voice of experience.

I did, though. I experienced elementary education. Maybe parents tend to glorify it. yeah, it's a big deal, but no, they really don't have the time or attention to make a huge difference.

[Doctor Phibes]

@horace said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@doctor-phibes said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@horace said in Don't reform it. End it.:

It's like nobody attended the same grade schools as I did. Do you think a parent can't provide whatever that was, in terms of information? The teachers at those schools don't depend on their gained knowledge, they depend on text books and lesson plans generated by a community of teachers. What's to stop a parent from relying on those same materials? Are text books impossible to come by? Who on earth thinks your average grade school teacher has some special intelligence about anything other than corralling kids? You still won't find anybody with special intelligence about anything until you're going for a PhD, and then only maybe.

Here speaks the voice of experience.

I did, though. I experienced elementary education. Maybe parents tend to glorify it. yeah, it's a big deal, but no, they really don't have the time or attention to make a huge difference.

Going to school isn't the same as bloody teaching it. Any fucking idiot can get through school.

I can work a computer. I can't bloody program one.

[Horace]

@doctor-phibes said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@horace said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@doctor-phibes said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@horace said in Don't reform it. End it.:

It's like nobody attended the same grade schools as I did. Do you think a parent can't provide whatever that was, in terms of information? The teachers at those schools don't depend on their gained knowledge, they depend on text books and lesson plans generated by a community of teachers. What's to stop a parent from relying on those same materials? Are text books impossible to come by? Who on earth thinks your average grade school teacher has some special intelligence about anything other than corralling kids? You still won't find anybody with special intelligence about anything until you're going for a PhD, and then only maybe.

Here speaks the voice of experience.

I did, though. I experienced elementary education. Maybe parents tend to glorify it. yeah, it's a big deal, but no, they really don't have the time or attention to make a huge difference.

Going to school isn't the same as bloody teaching it. Any fucking idiot can get through school.

At the end of the day, they're the person in front of the chalkboard reminding you to do your homework, or to clean your room. There isn't more of a potential for them to make a difference. How creepy is it to think a teacher is making a difference in a kid's life anyway?

[Doctor Phibes]

@horace said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@doctor-phibes said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@horace said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@doctor-phibes said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@horace said in Don't reform it. End it.:

It's like nobody attended the same grade schools as I did. Do you think a parent can't provide whatever that was, in terms of information? The teachers at those schools don't depend on their gained knowledge, they depend on text books and lesson plans generated by a community of teachers. What's to stop a parent from relying on those same materials? Are text books impossible to come by? Who on earth thinks your average grade school teacher has some special intelligence about anything other than corralling kids? You still won't find anybody with special intelligence about anything until you're going for a PhD, and then only maybe.

Here speaks the voice of experience.

I did, though. I experienced elementary education. Maybe parents tend to glorify it. yeah, it's a big deal, but no, they really don't have the time or attention to make a huge difference.

Going to school isn't the same as bloody teaching it. Any fucking idiot can get through school.

At the end of the day, they're the person in front of the chalkboard reminding you to do your homework, or to clean your room. There isn't more of a potential for them to make a difference. How creepy is it to think a teacher is making a difference in a kid's life anyway?

This is one of those times when I can't actually tell whether you're been sarcastic or not

[Horace]

@doctor-phibes said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@horace said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@doctor-phibes said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@horace said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@doctor-phibes said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@horace said in Don't reform it. End it.:

It's like nobody attended the same grade schools as I did. Do you think a parent can't provide whatever that was, in terms of information? The teachers at those schools don't depend on their gained knowledge, they depend on text books and lesson plans generated by a community of teachers. What's to stop a parent from relying on those same materials? Are text books impossible to come by? Who on earth thinks your average grade school teacher has some special intelligence about anything other than corralling kids? You still won't find anybody with special intelligence about anything until you're going for a PhD, and then only maybe.

Here speaks the voice of experience.

I did, though. I experienced elementary education. Maybe parents tend to glorify it. yeah, it's a big deal, but no, they really don't have the time or attention to make a huge difference.

Going to school isn't the same as bloody teaching it. Any fucking idiot can get through school.

At the end of the day, they're the person in front of the chalkboard reminding you to do your homework, or to clean your room. There isn't more of a potential for them to make a difference. How creepy is it to think a teacher is making a difference in a kid's life anyway?

This is one of those times when I can't actually tell whether you're been sarcastic or not

I'm not. I do believe that teachers at the elementary grade level are overrated or maybe underrated. If they're surrogate parents, then there's an issue.

[Copper]

@horace said in Don't reform it. End it.:

How creepy is it to think a teacher is making a difference in a kid's life anyway?

My understanding is that teachers these days spend a lot of time helping children select a gender.

Selecting a new gender sould be considered making a difference.

[Doctor Phibes]

@horace said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@doctor-phibes said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@horace said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@doctor-phibes said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@horace said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@doctor-phibes said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@horace said in Don't reform it. End it.:

It's like nobody attended the same grade schools as I did. Do you think a parent can't provide whatever that was, in terms of information? The teachers at those schools don't depend on their gained knowledge, they depend on text books and lesson plans generated by a community of teachers. What's to stop a parent from relying on those same materials? Are text books impossible to come by? Who on earth thinks your average grade school teacher has some special intelligence about anything other than corralling kids? You still won't find anybody with special intelligence about anything until you're going for a PhD, and then only maybe.

Here speaks the voice of experience.

I did, though. I experienced elementary education. Maybe parents tend to glorify it. yeah, it's a big deal, but no, they really don't have the time or attention to make a huge difference.

Going to school isn't the same as bloody teaching it. Any fucking idiot can get through school.

At the end of the day, they're the person in front of the chalkboard reminding you to do your homework, or to clean your room. There isn't more of a potential for them to make a difference. How creepy is it to think a teacher is making a difference in a kid's life anyway?

This is one of those times when I can't actually tell whether you're been sarcastic or not

I'm not. I do believe that teachers at the elementary grade level are overrated or maybe underrated. If they're surrogate parents, then there's an issue.

You should give it a go. I saw the world of education a lot differently after a year of teacher training. It was easily the toughest year of my life.

[Jolly]

@doctor-phibes said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@jolly said in Don't reform it. End it.:

This ain't Little House on the Prairie, y'all...

Ms. Ingalls Wilder certainly wrote a lot better than the author of the article you quoted.

I know, unnecessary snark. Still....

Fuck you and the horse you rode in on.

Grammatically correct and succinct. How's that?

[Aqua Letifer]

@horace said in Don't reform it. End it.:

How creepy is it to think a teacher is making a difference in a kid's life anyway?

My grandmother was a 4th grade teacher for her entire working life. Her eulogy was a stack of letters 5th grade students wrote to her about how she impacted their life. You don't know what you're talking about.

Most teachers do their job. Some of them suck. A few permanently change lives.

[Horace]

@aqua-letifer said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@horace said in Don't reform it. End it.:

How creepy is it to think a teacher is making a difference in a kid's life anyway?

My grandmother was a 4th grade teacher for her entire working life. Her eulogy was a stack of letters 5th grade students wrote to her about how she impacted their life. You don't know what you're talking about.

Most teachers do their job. Some of them suck. A few permanently change lives.

Yes a few permanently change lives. I'm reminded of our Kenny, I know he had a teacher, and that person was so much better than his own parents. It can at times take only one. Just a beacon of light, because I know that people do care, but not everybody does.

[Doctor Phibes]

@horace said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@aqua-letifer said in Don't reform it. End it.:

@horace said in Don't reform it. End it.:

How creepy is it to think a teacher is making a difference in a kid's life anyway?

My grandmother was a 4th grade teacher for her entire working life. Her eulogy was a stack of letters 5th grade students wrote to her about how she impacted their life. You don't know what you're talking about.

Most teachers do their job. Some of them suck. A few permanently change lives.

Yes a few permanently change lives. I'm reminded of our Kenny, I know he had a teacher, and that person was so much better than his own parents. It can at times take only one. Just a beacon of light, because I know that people do care, but not everybody does.

I had a wonderful home life, and awesome parents, but I still remember the teachers who inspired me.

As a parent, visiting my kids' schools, some teachers stand out there, too.