The truth is out there - Conspiracies
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I'm saying this with a wink to the X-Files, conspiracy theorists, etc.
I used to work with a surgeon who is a really good guy. He was/is a yuge Trump supporter, and a "skeptic" about what's going on with regard to the pandemic. He sends me a text every now and then.
This is Alex Jones stuff, and I'm kind of disappointed that someone who I took for being pretty smart has fallen down this rabbit hole.
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The Vaccine Causes The Virus To Be More Dangerous. I think I posted this before.
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Drug Approvals - From Invention to Market ... A 12- Year Trip
But yeeesh!
One of his points is that the vaccines have not been approved by the FDA, only have had "emergency use authorization." The fact that the DoD is going to mandate vaccination for all military suggests that full FDA approval is around the corner.
wrote on 10 Aug 2021, 12:16 last edited by@george-k said in The truth is out there:
I'm kind of disappointed that someone who I took for being pretty smart has fallen down this rabbit hole.
Politics makes people stupid. Both sides, obviously, before somebody jumps in with 'what about liberalism...?'
I'd go as far as saying that being a true believer in anything isn't conducive to rational thought.
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wrote on 20 Aug 2021, 21:10 last edited by
I got a call from my friend this afternoon. He was in the car, driving home.
He called to talk about vaccines.
The conversation included things like, "Is there ANY drug that is given without a discussion of possible side effects?"
"Is informed consent obtained before vaccines are given?"
"Are you aware of all the complications being reported to the CDC and ignored after vaccination?"
I tried to remain polite, but it was difficult.
I succeeded.
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@george-k said in The truth is out there:
I'm kind of disappointed that someone who I took for being pretty smart has fallen down this rabbit hole.
Politics makes people stupid. Both sides, obviously, before somebody jumps in with 'what about liberalism...?'
I'd go as far as saying that being a true believer in anything isn't conducive to rational thought.
wrote on 20 Aug 2021, 21:13 last edited by@doctor-phibes said in The truth is out there:
Politics makes people stupid.
Yes.
I'd go as far as saying that being a true believer in anything isn't conducive to rational thought.
Yes.
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wrote on 20 Aug 2021, 21:46 last edited by
That is irrational.
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I got a call from my friend this afternoon. He was in the car, driving home.
He called to talk about vaccines.
The conversation included things like, "Is there ANY drug that is given without a discussion of possible side effects?"
"Is informed consent obtained before vaccines are given?"
"Are you aware of all the complications being reported to the CDC and ignored after vaccination?"
I tried to remain polite, but it was difficult.
I succeeded.
wrote on 20 Aug 2021, 21:51 last edited by@george-k said in The truth is out there:
I got a call from my friend this afternoon. He was in the car, driving home.
He called to talk about vaccines.
The conversation included things like, "Is there ANY drug that is given without a discussion of possible side effects?"
"Is informed consent obtained before vaccines are given?"
"Are you aware of all the complications being reported to the CDC and ignored after vaccination?"
I tried to remain polite, but it was difficult.
I succeeded.
Read this, and remind yourself that it happened before ever trying to explain the obvious to anyone:
https://www.mentalfloss.com/article/76144/why-no-one-wanted-aws-third-pound-burger
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wrote on 24 Aug 2021, 11:46 last edited by
Geez. He sent me this yesterday.
(note the site is promoting RFK Jr.'s book)
No need to read the article, just click through some of the links.
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Geez. He sent me this yesterday.
(note the site is promoting RFK Jr.'s book)
No need to read the article, just click through some of the links.
wrote on 24 Aug 2021, 12:28 last edited by LuFins Dad@george-k said in The truth is out there:
Geez. He sent me this yesterday.
(note the site is promoting RFK Jr.'s book)
No need to read the article, just click through some of the links.
And this guy is a surgeon. Probably 4 years as a Biochem major and another 4 in Medical School. An entire career in medicine treating patients, interacting with colleagues, and reading all the medical journals staying up to date with treatments, medicines, etc… So as a common layman, I would expect him to be far better educated thanI am. So if I knew this guy and he was sending me this stuff, I would have to lend it credence. How many people is this guy influencing just because he’s a surgeon?
Now, regarding the article, even if there have been 100,000 serious adverse reactions (and I sincerely doubt most of those) then you are looking at 1 out of every 10,000 vaccinated people having a bad reaction. That’s a lot better than the one out of every 100 dying from COVID and the 2 out of 10 that have long term debilitating effects from the disease.
Still, I do have to wonder what happened to this guy that he has such a mistrust for the medical authorities?
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wrote on 24 Aug 2021, 12:47 last edited by
You mean the vaccine that in 6 mo tbs has gone from "the vaccine will end the pandemic" to "You can still get covid even if you've been vaccinated" to "You can pass covid on to others even if you've been vaccinated" to "You can still die from covid even if you've been vaccinated" to "the unvaccinated are killing the vaccinated"?
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@george-k said in The truth is out there:
Geez. He sent me this yesterday.
(note the site is promoting RFK Jr.'s book)
No need to read the article, just click through some of the links.
And this guy is a surgeon. Probably 4 years as a Biochem major and another 4 in Medical School. An entire career in medicine treating patients, interacting with colleagues, and reading all the medical journals staying up to date with treatments, medicines, etc… So as a common layman, I would expect him to be far better educated thanI am. So if I knew this guy and he was sending me this stuff, I would have to lend it credence. How many people is this guy influencing just because he’s a surgeon?
Now, regarding the article, even if there have been 100,000 serious adverse reactions (and I sincerely doubt most of those) then you are looking at 1 out of every 10,000 vaccinated people having a bad reaction. That’s a lot better than the one out of every 100 dying from COVID and the 2 out of 10 that have long term debilitating effects from the disease.
Still, I do have to wonder what happened to this guy that he has such a mistrust for the medical authorities?
wrote on 24 Aug 2021, 12:49 last edited by@lufins-dad he's always been a bit of a conspiracy-theory guy. Although he and I agree on political things, for the most part, this kind of stuff really bothers me. He is now retired, so at worst, he's talking to his friends, who may give credibility for his education and experience.
He and I talked on the phone about a week ago, and he started throwing out these numbers, and I pointed out that the risks of not being vaccinated. He dismissed it, of course. I commented on the mandatory (if you want your kids in school) vaccinations for measles, etc., and he reverted to the "EUA" argument.
I gave up after a while.
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You mean the vaccine that in 6 mo tbs has gone from "the vaccine will end the pandemic" to "You can still get covid even if you've been vaccinated" to "You can pass covid on to others even if you've been vaccinated" to "You can still die from covid even if you've been vaccinated" to "the unvaccinated are killing the vaccinated"?
wrote on 24 Aug 2021, 12:50 last edited by@larry said in The truth is out there:
You mean the vaccine that in 6 mo tbs has gone from "the vaccine will end the pandemic" to "You can still get covid even if you've been vaccinated" to "You can pass covid on to others even if you've been vaccinated" to "You can still die from covid even if you've been vaccinated" to "the unvaccinated are killing the vaccinated"?
Yeah, that one. The one that's more effective than the flu shot you get yearly, the one that's more effective than the mumps/measels vaccine.
That one.
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@larry said in The truth is out there:
You mean the vaccine that in 6 mo tbs has gone from "the vaccine will end the pandemic" to "You can still get covid even if you've been vaccinated" to "You can pass covid on to others even if you've been vaccinated" to "You can still die from covid even if you've been vaccinated" to "the unvaccinated are killing the vaccinated"?
Yeah, that one. The one that's more effective than the flu shot you get yearly, the one that's more effective than the mumps/measels vaccine.
That one.
wrote on 24 Aug 2021, 13:24 last edited by@george-k said in The truth is out there:
@larry said in The truth is out there:
You mean the vaccine that in 6 mo tbs has gone from "the vaccine will end the pandemic" to "You can still get covid even if you've been vaccinated" to "You can pass covid on to others even if you've been vaccinated" to "You can still die from covid even if you've been vaccinated" to "the unvaccinated are killing the vaccinated"?
Yeah, that one. The one that's more effective than the flu shot you get yearly, the one that's more effective than the mumps/measels vaccine.
That one.
Speaking of the flu vaccine, would any of our resident medical experts care to hazard a guess why the flu vaccine seems to help prevent severe COVID?
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@george-k said in The truth is out there:
@larry said in The truth is out there:
You mean the vaccine that in 6 mo tbs has gone from "the vaccine will end the pandemic" to "You can still get covid even if you've been vaccinated" to "You can pass covid on to others even if you've been vaccinated" to "You can still die from covid even if you've been vaccinated" to "the unvaccinated are killing the vaccinated"?
Yeah, that one. The one that's more effective than the flu shot you get yearly, the one that's more effective than the mumps/measels vaccine.
That one.
Speaking of the flu vaccine, would any of our resident medical experts care to hazard a guess why the flu vaccine seems to help prevent severe COVID?
wrote on 24 Aug 2021, 14:26 last edited by@lufins-dad said in The truth is out there:
would any of our resident medical experts
I'm not a doctor, but I'm pretty sure it's do with the immune system and other stuff. Probably prions. Also, it's idiopathic.
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wrote on 24 Aug 2021, 15:11 last edited by
@george-k said in The truth is out there:
@larry said in The truth is out there:
You mean the vaccine that in 6 mo tbs has gone from "the vaccine will end the pandemic" to "You can still get covid even if you've been vaccinated" to "You can pass covid on to others even if you've been vaccinated" to "You can still die from covid even if you've been vaccinated" to "the unvaccinated are killing the vaccinated"?
Yeah, that one. The one that's more effective than the flu shot you get yearly, the one that's more effective than the mumps/measels vaccine.
That one.
Oh, ok.... i took tha.t one....
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wrote on 26 Aug 2021, 22:38 last edited by
Again, I'm just linking stuff that my friend is sending.
Reposting is not agreement!
The FDA approved the Pfizer COVID-19 vaccine this week but one expert in the field is asserting that the vaccine that has been being given to people and is under Emergency Use Authorization and the vaccine that now enjoys “FDA approval” are not the same.
Dr. Robert Malone, inventor of the mRNA technology behind the COVID vaccines, spoke with Steve Bannon, host of the popular podcast the War Room, and said that the FDA approved shot and the EUA shot are not one in the same.
Bannon asked, is the “authorized” vaccine now ready to be administered to patients?
“It’s absolutely not available,” Malone explained. “The little trick that they’ve done here is that they’ve issued two letters, separate letters for two separate vaccines. The Pfizer vaccine which is what is currently available, is still under emergency use authorization, and it still has the liability shield.”
He added, “The product that’s licensed is the BioNTech product which is substantially similar but not necessarily identical. It’s called Comirnaty… and it’s not yet available. They haven’t started manufacturing it or labeling it and that’s the one that the liability waiver will no longer apply.”
“So the one that’s actually licensed is not yet available and when it does become available it will no longer have the liability shield.”
Dr. Malone has previously warned that Americans have not been provided with enough information to decide whether or not to take the chances on getting the experimental COVID vaccines. He says we just don’t know if the supposed benefits outweigh the risks.
"Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08
The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.
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wrote on 26 Aug 2021, 22:48 last edited by
Yeah, I've argued with some folks over this one, too.
The ones that believe the X-files are real...
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Again, I'm just linking stuff that my friend is sending.
Reposting is not agreement!
The FDA approved the Pfizer COVID-19 vaccine this week but one expert in the field is asserting that the vaccine that has been being given to people and is under Emergency Use Authorization and the vaccine that now enjoys “FDA approval” are not the same.
Dr. Robert Malone, inventor of the mRNA technology behind the COVID vaccines, spoke with Steve Bannon, host of the popular podcast the War Room, and said that the FDA approved shot and the EUA shot are not one in the same.
Bannon asked, is the “authorized” vaccine now ready to be administered to patients?
“It’s absolutely not available,” Malone explained. “The little trick that they’ve done here is that they’ve issued two letters, separate letters for two separate vaccines. The Pfizer vaccine which is what is currently available, is still under emergency use authorization, and it still has the liability shield.”
He added, “The product that’s licensed is the BioNTech product which is substantially similar but not necessarily identical. It’s called Comirnaty… and it’s not yet available. They haven’t started manufacturing it or labeling it and that’s the one that the liability waiver will no longer apply.”
“So the one that’s actually licensed is not yet available and when it does become available it will no longer have the liability shield.”
Dr. Malone has previously warned that Americans have not been provided with enough information to decide whether or not to take the chances on getting the experimental COVID vaccines. He says we just don’t know if the supposed benefits outweigh the risks.
wrote on 26 Aug 2021, 22:52 last edited by@george-k said in The truth is out there:
Again, I'm just linking stuff that my friend is sending.
Reposting is not agreement!
The FDA approved the Pfizer COVID-19 vaccine this week but one expert in the field is asserting that the vaccine that has been being given to people and is under Emergency Use Authorization and the vaccine that now enjoys “FDA approval” are not the same.
Dr. Robert Malone, inventor of the mRNA technology behind the COVID vaccines, spoke with Steve Bannon, host of the popular podcast the War Room, and said that the FDA approved shot and the EUA shot are not one in the same.
Bannon asked, is the “authorized” vaccine now ready to be administered to patients?
“It’s absolutely not available,” Malone explained. “The little trick that they’ve done here is that they’ve issued two letters, separate letters for two separate vaccines. The Pfizer vaccine which is what is currently available, is still under emergency use authorization, and it still has the liability shield.”
He added, “The product that’s licensed is the BioNTech product which is substantially similar but not necessarily identical. It’s called Comirnaty… and it’s not yet available. They haven’t started manufacturing it or labeling it and that’s the one that the liability waiver will no longer apply.”
“So the one that’s actually licensed is not yet available and when it does become available it will no longer have the liability shield.”
Dr. Malone has previously warned that Americans have not been provided with enough information to decide whether or not to take the chances on getting the experimental COVID vaccines. He says we just don’t know if the supposed benefits outweigh the risks.
I heard this one last night from my wife’s cousin who is an x-Ray tech and vehemently against taking these vaccines (though she does seem open to future vaccines). I didn’t even have a clue as to how to dispute it.
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wrote on 26 Aug 2021, 23:14 last edited by Doctor Phibes
All these arguments sound a lot like the 9-11 conspiracy folks. It's not worth engaging - as somebody here once said, you'll find that you've just wasted 3 hours researching the melting point and properties of steel, and when you get back to them they've not just moved the goal-posts, they've erected a whole new stadium.
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All these arguments sound a lot like the 9-11 conspiracy folks. It's not worth engaging - as somebody here once said, you'll find that you've just wasted 3 hours researching the melting point and properties of steel, and when you get back to them they've not just moved the goal-posts, they've erected a whole new stadium.
wrote on 26 Aug 2021, 23:24 last edited by@doctor-phibes said in The truth is out there:
It's not worth engaging
Is it possible that someone could find any valid fault with one of the covid vaccines?
Just theoretically possible I mean.
I can't imagine any flaws in real life.
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@doctor-phibes said in The truth is out there:
It's not worth engaging
Is it possible that someone could find any valid fault with one of the covid vaccines?
Just theoretically possible I mean.
I can't imagine any flaws in real life.
wrote on 26 Aug 2021, 23:29 last edited by@copper said in The truth is out there:
@doctor-phibes said in The truth is out there:
It's not worth engaging
Is it possible that someone could find any valid fault with one of the covid vaccines?
Just theoretically possible I mean.
I can't imagine any flaws in real life.
Of course it's possible. Everything has flaws. That's not the point. Like I said, it's our best chance.
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wrote on 26 Aug 2021, 23:42 last edited by
Well, I don’t know about all that but I got the booster today.
