J&J Suspended over blood clots
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Six cases of a rare clotting disorder out of seven million. One death.
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/13/us/politics/johnson-johnson-vaccine-blood-clots-fda-cdc.html
“I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill
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@mik said in J&J Suspended over blood clots:
Six cases of a rare clotting disorder out of seven million. One death.
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/13/us/politics/johnson-johnson-vaccine-blood-clots-fda-cdc.html
This doesn't seem like a reasonable response, unless they're concerned that not doing so would further empower the anti-vaccers. The reports on the Astra-Zeneca noted that Covid increases the likelihood of blood clots, so who's to say what caused these six cases?
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“I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill
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@mik said in J&J Suspended over blood clots:
The real comparison stat would be how many people develop this disorder normally. But they don't tell yo what that disorder is so you can't tell.
https://abcnews.go.com/US/us-calls-halt-johnson-johnson-vaccination-blood-clot/story?id=77040882
"In these cases, a type of blood clot called cerebral venous sinus thrombosis (CVST) was seen in combination with low levels of blood platelets (thrombocytopenia)," the statement read. "Treatment of this specific type of blood clot is different from the treatment that might typically be administered. Usually, an anticoagulant drug called heparin is used to treat blood clots. In this setting, administration of heparin may be dangerous, and alternative treatments need to be given."
The FDA and CDC said that these cases are extremely rare but that an abundance of caution was required.
"COVID-19 vaccine safety is a top priority for the federal government, and we take all reports of health problems following COVID-19 vaccination very seriously," the statement continued. "People who have received the J&J vaccine who develop severe headache, abdominal pain, leg pain, or shortness of breath within three weeks after vaccination should contact their health care provider. Health care providers are asked to report adverse events to the Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System."
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https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/conditions-and-diseases/cerebral-venous-sinus-thrombosis
Apparently in adults incidence is 5 in 1,000,000 per year. Under 18 it's 3 in 300,000. Mostly in infants. So essentially 1 in 1,000,000 adults over two weeks is pretty troubling.
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The risk of developing blood clots in the general public is about 0.1%. The risk of developing clots if you are a woman on birth control is between 0.3% and 1%.
The risk of developing blood clots after a serious case of CoVID is 20-30%.
The risk of developing a clot after J and J vaccination is currently .00088% (6 clots /68000000 doses given X 100).
The pause is necessary to collect data.At this moment the risk of developing a clot by walking down the street is higher than the risk of developing a clot after vaccination.
If you have received J and J's vaccine, don't panic. However, if you develop any new symptoms within about 3 weeks of vaccination, let your doctor know.
Again, the numbers are extremely small.The pause on J and J vaccinations is bad news for our immunization/herd immunity plan but people who have already received the vaccine need to remain calm and discuss concerns with their doctors.
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@mik said in J&J Suspended over blood clots:
You are confusing blood clots in general with this particular rare form of them. The odds are still very small, but first do no harm.
Did you notice if you get serious Covid the odds of a blood clot? You can’t not notice the elephant in the room.
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How does the chance of dying from Covid compare to the chance of dying after the vaccination?
If there's an alternative for the people who were going to get J&J, by all means suspend use, but if there isn't, it doesn't make sense.
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Trust the process.
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@lufins-dad said in J&J Suspended over blood clots:
Trust the process.
Well, we haven't much choice, but in my experience many of the people who do this kind work have a tendency towards hyper-caution.
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https://www.cbsnews.com/news/covid-vaccine-blood-clots-study-pfizer-astrazeneca-moderna-oxford/
London — A study by researchers at Oxford University in England suggests the risks of experiencing dangerous, rare blood clots in the brain are far higher in those who catch the coronavirus than in those who get either the AstraZeneca vaccine, or the vaccines made by Pfizer and Moderna in the U.S. The research shows that the number of people who experience clots after getting the vaccines made by the American pharmaceutical giants appears very similar to the number who get the rare condition after a shot of the AstraZeneca drug, which was developed in conjunction with Oxford's vaccine institute.
A key finding of the research, revealed Thursday as a "pre-print" study which has yet to be reviewed by other scientists, was that the risk of experiencing a blood clot in the brain was about 95 times higher for people who contract COVID-19 than in the general population.
That's yet another serious health threat associated with the disease, and one the scientists hoped would boost confidence in all of the major vaccines currently available in the Western world, as their research suggests the drugs carry a significantly lower threat of clotting than the disease they've been proven to fend off.
The data showed that about 4 in every 1 million people who get the American-made vaccines experience cerebral venous thrombosis (CVT), or blood clots in the brain. With the AstraZeneca vaccine, which works in a different way and is similar to the Johnson & Johnson shot, the research showed an incidence rate of about 5 in every 1 million.
That equates to a risk of CVT 10-times greater for people who catch the coronavirus than for those who get the Pfizer or Moderna vaccines, and 8-times greater for those given the AstraZeneca shot.
"There are concerns about possible associations between vaccines, and CVT, causing governments and regulators to restrict the use of certain vaccines," noted Paul Harrison, Professor of Psychiatry and Head of Oxford's Translational Neurobiology Group. "We've reached two important conclusions. Firstly, COVID-19 markedly increases the risk of CVT, adding to the list of blood clotting problems this infection causes. Secondly, the COVID-19 risk is higher than seen with the current vaccines, even for those under 30; something that should be taken into account when considering the balances between risks and benefits for vaccination."
The research released by Oxford on Thursday found that about 39 of every 1 million people who contract COVID-19 are likely to experience the clots on the brain. The scientists stressed that the point of their research was not to compare vaccines, but to gather firm data on the risks of all the vaccines compared to the risks associated with catching COVID-19.
So, you're more likely to get the CVT from COVID vs the vaccine. But, what are the chances of you getting COVID?
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Head starting to hurt... THE MATHS! THE MATHS!
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Ok, we’re seeing this with AZ and J&J. Is this due to both of them using an Adenovirus?
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U.S. regulators on Monday added a new warning to Johnson & Johnson’s COVID-19 vaccine about links to a rare and potentially dangerous neurological reaction, but said it’s not entirely clear the shot caused the problem.
The Food and Drug Administration announced the new warning, flagging reports of Guillain-Barre syndrome, an immune system disorder that can causes muscle weakness and occasionally paralysis. Health officials described the side effect as a “small possible risk” for those getting the shot.
The action comes after the FDA and the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reviewed reports of about 100 people developing the syndrome after receiving the one-dose vaccine. Almost all of were hospitalized and one person died, the FDA said.
Guillain-Barre syndrome occurs when the body’s immune system mistakenly attacks some of its nerve cells, causing muscle weakness and sometimes paralysis that typically is temporary. An estimated 3,000 to 6,000 people develop the syndrome each year, according to the CDC.
The number of cases reported in connection with J&J’s vaccine represents a tiny fraction of the nearly 13 million Americans who have received the one-dose shot. Most cases were reported in men — many 50 years old and up — and usually about two weeks after vaccination.
I know two people who've had Guillan-Barre. One was a nurse that lived down the hall when I was a resident. She showed up for work with Mrs. George one day and told her that she couldn't feel her feet. Lasted several weeks, but she made a complete recovery.
The other one was a neighbor in the condo - she caught it in Florida years ago, it left her wheelchair-bound. She suffered all the complications of an incomplete quadriplegia, eventually dying from complications of pressure sores (infection, etc).
Edit:
So if there are 4500 cases in the US per year, that's about 375 per month. I'd assume that half are male, so about 180 men get this per month. I wonder if this is a spike over the usual number.
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A friend of mine's niece got it in her early twenties about 3 years ago. It left her blind, and in a wheelchair, and of course pretty much suicidal. She'd just got married, and her husband left as he couldn't take it. Just an awful situation.
