French Government Says No to Virginity Test
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wrote on 2 Apr 2021, 15:50 last edited by Renauda 4 Feb 2021, 16:01
The government should be forbidding this.
It is stupid, tribal and cruelly invasive, and I am more than certain it is forced on Muslim women and girls.
If Muslims want to do it, they can consult a licensed physician practicing in a Muslim country but so long as they reside in France it is the business of French government whether or not to permit medical certification of a woman's virginity.
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The government should be forbidding this.
It is stupid, tribal and cruelly invasive, and I am more than certain it is forced on Muslim women and girls.
If Muslims want to do it, they can consult a licensed physician practicing in a Muslim country but so long as they reside in France it is the business of French government whether or not to permit medical certification of a woman's virginity.
wrote on 2 Apr 2021, 15:59 last edited by@renauda said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
The government should be forbidding this.
It is stupid, tribal and cruelly invasive, and I am more certain it is forced on Muslim women and girls.
If Muslims want to do it, they can consult a licensed physician practicing a Muslim country but so long as they reside in France it is the business of French government whether or not to permit medical certification of a woman's virginity.
+1
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wrote on 2 Apr 2021, 16:07 last edited by
Once again, this is all symbol by the left-leaning and all substance by the right-leaning. The story is clear that historically and culturally, this practice occurs outside of official medical channels. So to those who value the practice, they will do it outside those channels, if it is most expedient to do so. This is a non-issue, but pounced upon by those who want to enforce their own idea of virtue by mobbing up with the government.
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wrote on 2 Apr 2021, 16:21 last edited by
From your perspective Horace, I am sure you are probably right.
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The government should be forbidding this.
It is stupid, tribal and cruelly invasive, and I am more than certain it is forced on Muslim women and girls.
If Muslims want to do it, they can consult a licensed physician practicing in a Muslim country but so long as they reside in France it is the business of French government whether or not to permit medical certification of a woman's virginity.
wrote on 2 Apr 2021, 16:30 last edited by@renauda said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
The government should be forbidding this.
It is stupid, tribal and cruelly invasive, and I am more than certain it is forced on Muslim women and girls.
If Muslims want to do it, they can consult a licensed physician practicing in a Muslim country but so long as they reside in France it is the business of French government whether or not to permit medical certification of a woman's virginity.
Ok, First Nation citizens of Canada do not have to obey the same game laws as other citizens.
I think that should be forbidden.
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@renauda said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
The government should be forbidding this.
It is stupid, tribal and cruelly invasive, and I am more than certain it is forced on Muslim women and girls.
If Muslims want to do it, they can consult a licensed physician practicing in a Muslim country but so long as they reside in France it is the business of French government whether or not to permit medical certification of a woman's virginity.
Ok, First Nation citizens of Canada do not have to obey the same game laws as other citizens.
I think that should be forbidden.
wrote on 2 Apr 2021, 16:33 last edited by Doctor Phibes 4 Feb 2021, 16:33@jolly said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
@renauda said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
The government should be forbidding this.
It is stupid, tribal and cruelly invasive, and I am more than certain it is forced on Muslim women and girls.
If Muslims want to do it, they can consult a licensed physician practicing in a Muslim country but so long as they reside in France it is the business of French government whether or not to permit medical certification of a woman's virginity.
Ok, First Nation citizens of Canada do not have to obey the same game laws as other citizens.
I think that should be forbidden.
I think you're full of shit
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@jolly said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
@renauda said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
The government should be forbidding this.
It is stupid, tribal and cruelly invasive, and I am more than certain it is forced on Muslim women and girls.
If Muslims want to do it, they can consult a licensed physician practicing in a Muslim country but so long as they reside in France it is the business of French government whether or not to permit medical certification of a woman's virginity.
Ok, First Nation citizens of Canada do not have to obey the same game laws as other citizens.
I think that should be forbidden.
I think you're full of shit
wrote on 2 Apr 2021, 16:35 last edited by@doctor-phibes said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
@jolly said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
@renauda said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
The government should be forbidding this.
It is stupid, tribal and cruelly invasive, and I am more than certain it is forced on Muslim women and girls.
If Muslims want to do it, they can consult a licensed physician practicing in a Muslim country but so long as they reside in France it is the business of French government whether or not to permit medical certification of a woman's virginity.
Ok, First Nation citizens of Canada do not have to obey the same game laws as other citizens.
I think that should be forbidden.
I think you're full of shit
Nah, the game law thing is true.
It's the flip side of what you are advocating in this thread, of which neither makes sense...
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Once again, this is all symbol by the left-leaning and all substance by the right-leaning. The story is clear that historically and culturally, this practice occurs outside of official medical channels. So to those who value the practice, they will do it outside those channels, if it is most expedient to do so. This is a non-issue, but pounced upon by those who want to enforce their own idea of virtue by mobbing up with the government.
wrote on 2 Apr 2021, 16:43 last edited by@horace said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
Once again, this is all symbol by the left-leaning and all substance by the right-leaning.
Once again, Horace sets us straight. Thanks Horace.
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@renauda said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
The government should be forbidding this.
It is stupid, tribal and cruelly invasive, and I am more than certain it is forced on Muslim women and girls.
If Muslims want to do it, they can consult a licensed physician practicing in a Muslim country but so long as they reside in France it is the business of French government whether or not to permit medical certification of a woman's virginity.
Ok, First Nation citizens of Canada do not have to obey the same game laws as other citizens.
I think that should be forbidden.
wrote on 2 Apr 2021, 16:48 last edited by Renauda 4 Feb 2021, 19:03@jolly said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
Ok, First Nation citizens of Canada do not have to obey the same game laws as other citizens.
I think that should be forbidden.I agree, and those hunting and fishing rights should be abrogated. First Nations and some Metis have year round hunting rights on Crown lands and special fishing rights the rest of us do not. It may have made sense 150 years ago, but it does not any more.
So what's your point and what does this have to do with virginity certification on Muslim women and girls in France?
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@jolly said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
And let's expand this one a bit...Why is virginity a bad concept?
That's not the question you should be asking. The question you should be asking is what are the consequences of a failed test.
wrote on 2 Apr 2021, 17:05 last edited by@doctor-phibes said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
@jolly said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
And let's expand this one a bit...Why is virginity a bad concept?
That's not the question you should be asking. The question you should be asking is what are the consequences of a failed test.
Bingo
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wrote on 2 Apr 2021, 17:17 last edited by
The fact that treating women like shit is ingrained in some cultures is no excuse to allow women to be treated like shit in our countries.
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wrote on 2 Apr 2021, 17:29 last edited by
Horace is right that it is symbolic. But what it is symbolic of - the subjugation of women - is certainly not something we want to encourage.
while i agree with Jolly that chastity can be a virtue, there is no legitimate health issue in whether a woman is or is not a virgin. I see no reason doctors should be doing this. -
Once again, this is all symbol by the left-leaning and all substance by the right-leaning. The story is clear that historically and culturally, this practice occurs outside of official medical channels. So to those who value the practice, they will do it outside those channels, if it is most expedient to do so. This is a non-issue, but pounced upon by those who want to enforce their own idea of virtue by mobbing up with the government.
wrote on 2 Apr 2021, 17:50 last edited by@horace said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
this is all symbol by the left-leaning
Check with a left-leaning woman who gets subjected to this test, see how symbolic she finds it.
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wrote on 2 Apr 2021, 17:56 last edited by
While you're at it, you might want to check which particular substance is coming out of the right-leaning, too.
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@horace said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
this is all symbol by the left-leaning
Check with a left-leaning woman who gets subjected to this test, see how symbolic she finds it.
wrote on 2 Apr 2021, 18:02 last edited by@catseye3 said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
@horace said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
this is all symbol by the left-leaning
Check with a left-leaning woman who gets subjected to this test, see how symbolic she finds it.
Check with a Muslim woman. I dunno, do you think all orthodox Muslim women hate being Muslim? They sure do live under circumstances western women would hate.
Most westerners underestimate the degree to which humans are programmable, right down to the fundamentals of their sense of meaning and happiness.
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wrote on 2 Apr 2021, 18:06 last edited by Doctor Phibes 4 Feb 2021, 18:07
I had some close friends in England who were Muslim, born in the 60's and 70's, and some of the things that their parents, who were not British born, expected of them did not sit well with them, but they would go along with it so as not to cause trouble.
Children and young adults being subjected to this sort-of-unwillingly is not really defensible.
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Horace is right that it is symbolic. But what it is symbolic of - the subjugation of women - is certainly not something we want to encourage.
while i agree with Jolly that chastity can be a virtue, there is no legitimate health issue in whether a woman is or is not a virgin. I see no reason doctors should be doing this.wrote on 2 Apr 2021, 19:10 last edited by Renauda 4 Feb 2021, 19:12@mik said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
Horace is right that it is symbolic.
It would seem to Horace and perhaps a few others here, that everything the left does is purely symbolic and of little or no substance. But this is not a left right issue. This is a women's issue within a secular society issue. That is too nuanced for him.
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@mik said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
Horace is right that it is symbolic.
It would seem to Horace and perhaps a few others here, that everything the left does is purely symbolic and of little or no substance. But this is not a left right issue. This is a women's issue within a secular society issue. That is too nuanced for him.
wrote on 2 Apr 2021, 19:43 last edited by Catseye3 4 Mar 2021, 12:16@renauda said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
It would seem to Horace and perhaps a few others here, that everything the left does is purely symbolic and of little or no substance. This is a women's issue within a secular society issue.
Something like this can't be neatly categorized. It is pointless to talk in terms of Muslim vs. non-Muslim. Like Phibbs said, it's not unheard of for young Muslim women to object to this. And like Renauda said, it's a woman's issue. Having some stranger stick his finger up there to see if you're intact -- not meaning to generalize, but it has to be to some degree humiliating to a woman regardless of faith or culture. Be like getting a USDA Inspected stamp on your ass.
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@renauda said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
It would seem to Horace and perhaps a few others here, that everything the left does is purely symbolic and of little or no substance. This is a women's issue within a secular society issue.
Something like this can't be neatly categorized. It is pointless to talk in terms of Muslim vs. non-Muslim. Like Phibbs said, it's not unheard of for young Muslim women to object to this. And like Renauda said, it's a woman's issue. Having some stranger stick his finger up there to see if you're intact -- not meaning to generalize, but it has to be to some degree humiliating to a woman regardless of faith or culture. Be like getting a USDA Inspected stamp on your ass.
wrote on 2 Apr 2021, 20:42 last edited by@catseye3 said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
@renauda said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
It would seem to Horace and perhaps a few others here, that everything the left does is purely symbolic and of little or no substance. This is a women's issue within a secular society issue.
Something like this can't be neatly categorized. It is pointless to talk in terms of Muslim vs. non-Muslim. Like Phibbs said, it's not unheard of for young Muslim women to object to this. And like Renauda said, it's a woman's issue. Having some stranger stick his finger up there to see if you're intact -- not meaning to generalize, but it has to be to some degree humiliating to a woman regardless of faith or culture. Be like getting a USDA Inspection stamp on your ass.
I don't think they stamp them, they just issue a certificate....
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@catseye3 said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
@renauda said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
It would seem to Horace and perhaps a few others here, that everything the left does is purely symbolic and of little or no substance. This is a women's issue within a secular society issue.
Something like this can't be neatly categorized. It is pointless to talk in terms of Muslim vs. non-Muslim. Like Phibbs said, it's not unheard of for young Muslim women to object to this. And like Renauda said, it's a woman's issue. Having some stranger stick his finger up there to see if you're intact -- not meaning to generalize, but it has to be to some degree humiliating to a woman regardless of faith or culture. Be like getting a USDA Inspection stamp on your ass.
I don't think they stamp them, they just issue a certificate....
wrote on 2 Apr 2021, 21:27 last edited by Renauda 4 Feb 2021, 22:55@jolly said in French Government Says No to Virginity Test:
I don't think they stamp them, they just issue a certificate....
And to what standard does that comply? ISO something or another?
Or are we talking something else entirely? I am sure that certificates were is issued for all kinds of chattel purchases back in the day.