25,000
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@taiwan_girl said in 25,000:
I really think that the best way to stop illegal immigration is to make the people not want to leave their home country.
People illegally come to the US, not because they want to live a sub-standard life in the US, but in their minds, a sub-standard life in the US can be much much better than what they are leaving behind.
To come to a strange country, with a strange language, with (often) little skills, and sometimes/often not much chance of advancement is not something most people do because that is their dream. It is just that things are so bad in their present lives, economically, violence wise, tec.
I am more in favor of working to makes peoples lives better where they start, rather than trying to stop them once they are at the border.
How are you going to do that?
@taiwan_girl said in 25,000:
I really think that the best way to stop illegal immigration is to make the people not want to leave their home country.
People illegally come to the US, not because they want to live a sub-standard life in the US, but in their minds, a sub-standard life in the US can be much much better than what they are leaving behind.
To come to a strange country, with a strange language, with (often) little skills, and sometimes/often not much chance of advancement is not something most people do because that is their dream. It is just that things are so bad in their present lives, economically, violence wise, tec.
I am more in favor of working to makes peoples lives better where they start, rather than trying to stop them once they are at the border.
How are you going to do that?
Cut Social Security, this country becomes unaffordable for seniors and they all move south.
That solves a lot of problems. Of course it might create a few.
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They could grant Florida independence. Forcibly.
Let's be honest, it would solve a whole boatload of problems.
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They could grant Florida independence. Forcibly.
Let's be honest, it would solve a whole boatload of problems.
@doctor-phibes said in 25,000:
They could grant Florida independence. Forcibly.
Let's be honest, it would solve a whole boatload of problems.
How about everything south of the Mason-Dixon?
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@doctor-phibes said in 25,000:
They could grant Florida independence. Forcibly.
Let's be honest, it would solve a whole boatload of problems.
How about everything south of the Mason-Dixon?
@doctor-phibes said in 25,000:
They could grant Florida independence. Forcibly.
Let's be honest, it would solve a whole boatload of problems.
How about everything south of the Mason-Dixon?
I guess we could do without DC. It would certainly save us a boatload of money.
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@doctor-phibes said in 25,000:
They could grant Florida independence. Forcibly.
Let's be honest, it would solve a whole boatload of problems.
How about everything south of the Mason-Dixon?
I guess we could do without DC. It would certainly save us a boatload of money.
@doctor-phibes said in 25,000:
@doctor-phibes said in 25,000:
They could grant Florida independence. Forcibly.
Let's be honest, it would solve a whole boatload of problems.
How about everything south of the Mason-Dixon?
I guess we could do without DC. It would certainly save us a boatload of money.
Be happy to...Might be a fun undertakin'...
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@taiwan_girl said in 25,000:
I really think that the best way to stop illegal immigration is to make the people not want to leave their home country.
People illegally come to the US, not because they want to live a sub-standard life in the US, but in their minds, a sub-standard life in the US can be much much better than what they are leaving behind.
To come to a strange country, with a strange language, with (often) little skills, and sometimes/often not much chance of advancement is not something most people do because that is their dream. It is just that things are so bad in their present lives, economically, violence wise, tec.
I am more in favor of working to makes peoples lives better where they start, rather than trying to stop them once they are at the border.
How are you going to do that?
@taiwan_girl said in 25,000:
I really think that the best way to stop illegal immigration is to make the people not want to leave their home country.
People illegally come to the US, not because they want to live a sub-standard life in the US, but in their minds, a sub-standard life in the US can be much much better than what they are leaving behind.
To come to a strange country, with a strange language, with (often) little skills, and sometimes/often not much chance of advancement is not something most people do because that is their dream. It is just that things are so bad in their present lives, economically, violence wise, tec.
I am more in favor of working to makes peoples lives better where they start, rather than trying to stop them once they are at the border.
How are you going to do that?
Good question. I have experience on the micro side of things - village size, and maybe that is what it takes - village by village.
I may have said this story before, but I was involved (in a small way) in micro lending. One lady in India (in a village outside of Chennai) who who had her husband die, and had kids, did not have a good future to look forward too.
She did washing for others, and was a very hard worker, but only making just enough to survive. She was able to get a micro loan (I think about USD$150) to get additional equipment and last I hear, she had like 4 other ladies helping her.
Give people hope that things can get better where they are, and they will have less reason to desire to leave.
On a macro scale, I dont know what the answer is. There is a lot of corruption and violence in countries where people come to the US from. Concentrate on specific regions of those countries? Dont know. Work more on a micro scale with NGO companies? Dont know.
I know it is a huge question and no easy answers. But I do believe that stopping people at the border is not going to solve the problem. If people are desperate enough, they will find a way in.
Building a wall is not going to make them NOT want to come.
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As long as economic disparity exists at the level it does, and the enforcement of our border and our laws are lax, you will NEVER stop them from coming. You won't even slow them down.
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As long as economic disparity exists at the level it does, and the enforcement of our border and our laws are lax, you will NEVER stop them from coming. You won't even slow them down.
As long as economic disparity exists at the level it does, and the enforcement of our border and our laws are lax, you will NEVER stop them from coming. You won't even slow them down.
I mostly agree, and it seems like you agree with my point that stopping them at the border is not a good protocol. You will never stop them from coming.
My idea is to decrease the economic disparity. Building a border wall does nothing to help that,
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As long as economic disparity exists at the level it does, and the enforcement of our border and our laws are lax, you will NEVER stop them from coming. You won't even slow them down.
I mostly agree, and it seems like you agree with my point that stopping them at the border is not a good protocol. You will never stop them from coming.
My idea is to decrease the economic disparity. Building a border wall does nothing to help that,
@taiwan_girl said in 25,000:
As long as economic disparity exists at the level it does, and the enforcement of our border and our laws are lax, you will NEVER stop them from coming. You won't even slow them down.
I mostly agree, and it seems like you agree with my point that stopping them at the border is not a good protocol. You will never stop them from coming.
My idea is to decrease the economic disparity. Building a border wall does nothing to help that,
Yeah, but a mile-deep minefield would.
No, our borders are very hard to control, but if you have something to interdict them at the border, combined with robust punishment if caught, you have shut the river down to a drip.
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And something else to consider...
https://quillette.com/2021/02/15/do-lockdowns-work-only-if-you-lock-the-borders-down-too/
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And something else to consider...
https://quillette.com/2021/02/15/do-lockdowns-work-only-if-you-lock-the-borders-down-too/
And something else to consider...
https://quillette.com/2021/02/15/do-lockdowns-work-only-if-you-lock-the-borders-down-too/
Absolutely 100% agree. I have mentioned countries in Asia that have been "successful" with COVID and one of the common things that they did (in addition to things like contact trace, masks, etc) is making the "bubble" around the whole country.
But, something like that is not able to sustain long term, especially when using it for immigration. I think long term, better (and cheaper) to make the people not want to leave their home country.
Building a border wall = band aid. Doesn't cure and only temporary
Making people want to stay in their country = vaccine LOL
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And something else to consider...
https://quillette.com/2021/02/15/do-lockdowns-work-only-if-you-lock-the-borders-down-too/
Absolutely 100% agree. I have mentioned countries in Asia that have been "successful" with COVID and one of the common things that they did (in addition to things like contact trace, masks, etc) is making the "bubble" around the whole country.
But, something like that is not able to sustain long term, especially when using it for immigration. I think long term, better (and cheaper) to make the people not want to leave their home country.
Building a border wall = band aid. Doesn't cure and only temporary
Making people want to stay in their country = vaccine LOL
@taiwan_girl said in 25,000:
And something else to consider...
https://quillette.com/2021/02/15/do-lockdowns-work-only-if-you-lock-the-borders-down-too/
Absolutely 100% agree. I have mentioned countries in Asia that have been "successful" with COVID and one of the common things that they did (in addition to things like contact trace, masks, etc) is making the "bubble" around the whole country.
But, something like that is not able to sustain long term, especially when using it for immigration. I think long term, better (and cheaper) to make the people not want to leave their home country.
Building a border wall = band aid. Doesn't cure and only temporary
Making people want to stay in their country = vaccine LOL
Do you have any idea how much blood and treasure the American people have spent "trying to make other people's lives better"?
I'm not saying our foreign policy has always been altruistic. We are a great nation with our own interests. But we have stuck our necks out on more than one occasion.
Sometimes, it works. Most if the time, it doesn't. People have to fix themselves, if they wish to see real and lasting change. To just say, "let's make people not want to leave their own country" is mostly unworkable and reeks of naivety.
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@taiwan_girl said in 25,000:
And something else to consider...
https://quillette.com/2021/02/15/do-lockdowns-work-only-if-you-lock-the-borders-down-too/
Absolutely 100% agree. I have mentioned countries in Asia that have been "successful" with COVID and one of the common things that they did (in addition to things like contact trace, masks, etc) is making the "bubble" around the whole country.
But, something like that is not able to sustain long term, especially when using it for immigration. I think long term, better (and cheaper) to make the people not want to leave their home country.
Building a border wall = band aid. Doesn't cure and only temporary
Making people want to stay in their country = vaccine LOL
Do you have any idea how much blood and treasure the American people have spent "trying to make other people's lives better"?
I'm not saying our foreign policy has always been altruistic. We are a great nation with our own interests. But we have stuck our necks out on more than one occasion.
Sometimes, it works. Most if the time, it doesn't. People have to fix themselves, if they wish to see real and lasting change. To just say, "let's make people not want to leave their own country" is mostly unworkable and reeks of naivety.
@taiwan_girl said in 25,000:
And something else to consider...
https://quillette.com/2021/02/15/do-lockdowns-work-only-if-you-lock-the-borders-down-too/
Absolutely 100% agree. I have mentioned countries in Asia that have been "successful" with COVID and one of the common things that they did (in addition to things like contact trace, masks, etc) is making the "bubble" around the whole country.
But, something like that is not able to sustain long term, especially when using it for immigration. I think long term, better (and cheaper) to make the people not want to leave their home country.
Building a border wall = band aid. Doesn't cure and only temporary
Making people want to stay in their country = vaccine LOL
Do you have any idea how much blood and treasure the American people have spent "trying to make other people's lives better"?
I'm not saying our foreign policy has always been altruistic. We are a great nation with our own interests. But we have stuck our necks out on more than one occasion.
Sometimes, it works. Most if the time, it doesn't. People have to fix themselves, if they wish to see real and lasting change. To just say, "let's make people not want to leave their own country" is mostly unworkable and reeks of naivety.
I agree that the US has done more for other countries than any other country in the world. No doubt about that.
And I do believe that the efforts the US has made, do often work more than they dont.
But you are right, the people there in other countries have to have responsibility for the change also. It cannot be, and never should be, the US coming and saying, "Do this. Doesn't matter what YOU want. We know what we want you to do." That is a receipt for failure.
OVerall, people are pretty good. And in my experience in different countries, people who illegal immigrate do not do it as their first choice. IF there were a choice:
A. opportunity to improve their life in their home country
B. illegal immigrate to a strange country, different language, etc.The high majority of people will choose A
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As long as economic disparity exists at the level it does, and the enforcement of our border and our laws are lax, you will NEVER stop them from coming. You won't even slow them down.
I mostly agree, and it seems like you agree with my point that stopping them at the border is not a good protocol. You will never stop them from coming.
My idea is to decrease the economic disparity. Building a border wall does nothing to help that,
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@taiwan_girl said in 25,000:
@taiwan_girl said in 25,000:
And something else to consider...
https://quillette.com/2021/02/15/do-lockdowns-work-only-if-you-lock-the-borders-down-too/
Absolutely 100% agree. I have mentioned countries in Asia that have been "successful" with COVID and one of the common things that they did (in addition to things like contact trace, masks, etc) is making the "bubble" around the whole country.
But, something like that is not able to sustain long term, especially when using it for immigration. I think long term, better (and cheaper) to make the people not want to leave their home country.
Building a border wall = band aid. Doesn't cure and only temporary
Making people want to stay in their country = vaccine LOL
Do you have any idea how much blood and treasure the American people have spent "trying to make other people's lives better"?
I'm not saying our foreign policy has always been altruistic. We are a great nation with our own interests. But we have stuck our necks out on more than one occasion.
Sometimes, it works. Most if the time, it doesn't. People have to fix themselves, if they wish to see real and lasting change. To just say, "let's make people not want to leave their own country" is mostly unworkable and reeks of naivety.
I agree that the US has done more for other countries than any other country in the world. No doubt about that.
And I do believe that the efforts the US has made, do often work more than they dont.
But you are right, the people there in other countries have to have responsibility for the change also. It cannot be, and never should be, the US coming and saying, "Do this. Doesn't matter what YOU want. We know what we want you to do." That is a receipt for failure.
OVerall, people are pretty good. And in my experience in different countries, people who illegal immigrate do not do it as their first choice. IF there were a choice:
A. opportunity to improve their life in their home country
B. illegal immigrate to a strange country, different language, etc.The high majority of people will choose A
Often these countries are in the condition they are in because of poor leadership. Either corruption or incompetence and often both. The US giving money to these nations just winds up feeding the corrupt or being used incompetently. I’m reminded of the German “super rabbits” given to North Korea as part of a breeding program. The North Korean officers had a banquet to celebrate and ate all the rabbits.
Giving money to many of these countries is oftentimes just making things worse.
The Brad
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@taiwan_girl said in 25,000:
@taiwan_girl said in 25,000:
And something else to consider...
https://quillette.com/2021/02/15/do-lockdowns-work-only-if-you-lock-the-borders-down-too/
Absolutely 100% agree. I have mentioned countries in Asia that have been "successful" with COVID and one of the common things that they did (in addition to things like contact trace, masks, etc) is making the "bubble" around the whole country.
But, something like that is not able to sustain long term, especially when using it for immigration. I think long term, better (and cheaper) to make the people not want to leave their home country.
Building a border wall = band aid. Doesn't cure and only temporary
Making people want to stay in their country = vaccine LOL
Do you have any idea how much blood and treasure the American people have spent "trying to make other people's lives better"?
I'm not saying our foreign policy has always been altruistic. We are a great nation with our own interests. But we have stuck our necks out on more than one occasion.
Sometimes, it works. Most if the time, it doesn't. People have to fix themselves, if they wish to see real and lasting change. To just say, "let's make people not want to leave their own country" is mostly unworkable and reeks of naivety.
I agree that the US has done more for other countries than any other country in the world. No doubt about that.
And I do believe that the efforts the US has made, do often work more than they dont.
But you are right, the people there in other countries have to have responsibility for the change also. It cannot be, and never should be, the US coming and saying, "Do this. Doesn't matter what YOU want. We know what we want you to do." That is a receipt for failure.
OVerall, people are pretty good. And in my experience in different countries, people who illegal immigrate do not do it as their first choice. IF there were a choice:
A. opportunity to improve their life in their home country
B. illegal immigrate to a strange country, different language, etc.The high majority of people will choose A
Often these countries are in the condition they are in because of poor leadership. Either corruption or incompetence and often both. The US giving money to these nations just winds up feeding the corrupt or being used incompetently. I’m reminded of the German “super rabbits” given to North Korea as part of a breeding program. The North Korean officers had a banquet to celebrate and ate all the rabbits.
Giving money to many of these countries is oftentimes just making things worse.
@lufins-dad said in 25,000:
Often these countries are in the condition they are in because of poor leadership. Either corruption or incompetence and often both. The US giving money to these nations just winds up feeding the corrupt or being used incompetently. I’m reminded of the German “super rabbits” given to North Korea as part of a breeding program. The North Korean officers had a banquet to celebrate and ate all the rabbits.
Champion human rights and promote democracy. Do not lend support to despots and autocrats. Resist the temptation to support "our dictators" just for geopolitical expedience. That way you move the world towards the direction of electing good leaders.
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@lufins-dad said in 25,000:
Often these countries are in the condition they are in because of poor leadership. Either corruption or incompetence and often both. The US giving money to these nations just winds up feeding the corrupt or being used incompetently. I’m reminded of the German “super rabbits” given to North Korea as part of a breeding program. The North Korean officers had a banquet to celebrate and ate all the rabbits.
Champion human rights and promote democracy. Do not lend support to despots and autocrats. Resist the temptation to support "our dictators" just for geopolitical expedience. That way you move the world towards the direction of electing good leaders.
@lufins-dad said in 25,000:
Often these countries are in the condition they are in because of poor leadership. Either corruption or incompetence and often both. The US giving money to these nations just winds up feeding the corrupt or being used incompetently. I’m reminded of the German “super rabbits” given to North Korea as part of a breeding program. The North Korean officers had a banquet to celebrate and ate all the rabbits.
Champion human rights and promote democracy. Do not lend support to despots and autocrats. Resist the temptation to support "our dictators" just for geopolitical expedience. That way you move the world towards the direction of electing good leaders.
God Bless you...
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@lufins-dad said in 25,000:
Often these countries are in the condition they are in because of poor leadership. Either corruption or incompetence and often both. The US giving money to these nations just winds up feeding the corrupt or being used incompetently. I’m reminded of the German “super rabbits” given to North Korea as part of a breeding program. The North Korean officers had a banquet to celebrate and ate all the rabbits.
Champion human rights and promote democracy. Do not lend support to despots and autocrats. Resist the temptation to support "our dictators" just for geopolitical expedience. That way you move the world towards the direction of electing good leaders.
God Bless you...
Champion human rights and promote democracy. Do not lend support to despots and autocrats. Resist the temptation to support "our dictators" just for geopolitical expedience. That way you move the world towards the direction of electing good leaders.
God Bless you...
Thank you for your kind sentiment.
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@taiwan_girl said in 25,000:
@taiwan_girl said in 25,000:
And something else to consider...
https://quillette.com/2021/02/15/do-lockdowns-work-only-if-you-lock-the-borders-down-too/
Absolutely 100% agree. I have mentioned countries in Asia that have been "successful" with COVID and one of the common things that they did (in addition to things like contact trace, masks, etc) is making the "bubble" around the whole country.
But, something like that is not able to sustain long term, especially when using it for immigration. I think long term, better (and cheaper) to make the people not want to leave their home country.
Building a border wall = band aid. Doesn't cure and only temporary
Making people want to stay in their country = vaccine LOL
Do you have any idea how much blood and treasure the American people have spent "trying to make other people's lives better"?
I'm not saying our foreign policy has always been altruistic. We are a great nation with our own interests. But we have stuck our necks out on more than one occasion.
Sometimes, it works. Most if the time, it doesn't. People have to fix themselves, if they wish to see real and lasting change. To just say, "let's make people not want to leave their own country" is mostly unworkable and reeks of naivety.
I agree that the US has done more for other countries than any other country in the world. No doubt about that.
And I do believe that the efforts the US has made, do often work more than they dont.
But you are right, the people there in other countries have to have responsibility for the change also. It cannot be, and never should be, the US coming and saying, "Do this. Doesn't matter what YOU want. We know what we want you to do." That is a receipt for failure.
OVerall, people are pretty good. And in my experience in different countries, people who illegal immigrate do not do it as their first choice. IF there were a choice:
A. opportunity to improve their life in their home country
B. illegal immigrate to a strange country, different language, etc.The high majority of people will choose A
Often these countries are in the condition they are in because of poor leadership. Either corruption or incompetence and often both. The US giving money to these nations just winds up feeding the corrupt or being used incompetently. I’m reminded of the German “super rabbits” given to North Korea as part of a breeding program. The North Korean officers had a banquet to celebrate and ate all the rabbits.
Giving money to many of these countries is oftentimes just making things worse.
@lufins-dad said in 25,000:
@taiwan_girl said in 25,000:
@taiwan_girl said in 25,000:
And something else to consider...
https://quillette.com/2021/02/15/do-lockdowns-work-only-if-you-lock-the-borders-down-too/
Absolutely 100% agree. I have mentioned countries in Asia that have been "successful" with COVID and one of the common things that they did (in addition to things like contact trace, masks, etc) is making the "bubble" around the whole country.
But, something like that is not able to sustain long term, especially when using it for immigration. I think long term, better (and cheaper) to make the people not want to leave their home country.
Building a border wall = band aid. Doesn't cure and only temporary
Making people want to stay in their country = vaccine LOL
Do you have any idea how much blood and treasure the American people have spent "trying to make other people's lives better"?
I'm not saying our foreign policy has always been altruistic. We are a great nation with our own interests. But we have stuck our necks out on more than one occasion.
Sometimes, it works. Most if the time, it doesn't. People have to fix themselves, if they wish to see real and lasting change. To just say, "let's make people not want to leave their own country" is mostly unworkable and reeks of naivety.
I agree that the US has done more for other countries than any other country in the world. No doubt about that.
And I do believe that the efforts the US has made, do often work more than they dont.
But you are right, the people there in other countries have to have responsibility for the change also. It cannot be, and never should be, the US coming and saying, "Do this. Doesn't matter what YOU want. We know what we want you to do." That is a receipt for failure.
OVerall, people are pretty good. And in my experience in different countries, people who illegal immigrate do not do it as their first choice. IF there were a choice:
A. opportunity to improve their life in their home country
B. illegal immigrate to a strange country, different language, etc.The high majority of people will choose A
Often these countries are in the condition they are in because of poor leadership. Either corruption or incompetence and often both. The US giving money to these nations just winds up feeding the corrupt or being used incompetently. I’m reminded of the German “super rabbits” given to North Korea as part of a breeding program. The North Korean officers had a banquet to celebrate and ate all the rabbits.
Giving money to many of these countries is oftentimes just making things worse.
Agree with the first part for sure. You (general you) however cannot just walk away.
Moving to a more isolation policy will result in:
- giving power to others in the world (for example China)
- basically saying that our country will not be a superpower anymore in 100 years.
