Trump to unveil healthcare plan
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@Jolly said in Trump to unveil healthcare plan:
@Doctor-Phibes said in Trump to unveil healthcare plan:
@Larry said in Trump to unveil healthcare plan:
I'm old enough to remember what the health insurance market was like before politicians (oddly enough, the democrats) decided to jump in and "fix" it. Any insurance company was free to offer their products in any state they wanted to, the consumer had tons of options, competition kept premiums low. You could buy Major Medical plans with very low premiums. As an example, the insurance policy would pay 80% of your medical bills and you paid the other 20% until you had spent 1,000 out of your own pocket, then the insurance paid 100% 25 bucks a month. If you had a pre existing condition there would be a 6 month period that that condition was not covered, then after 6 months your pre existing condition was covered.
Then politicians (democrats) decided to "fix it" and regulated the hell out of it, and created the very mess you think they are going to fix now. So you see Obama care as a good thing, I see it, and your faith in the democrats as well, and some of the dumbest shit imaginable.
Mitt Romney (Rep) fixed the one in Massachusetts. This was prior to Obama being President.
I actually thought it was a good idea, since prior to this lots of people didn't have health insurance, which is a bloody stupid way to go through life unless you're very wealthy.
How's the vaunted NHS working out for the Brits nowadays?
Vaunted by who? Most Americans who talk about the NHS seem to be wingnuts trying to frighten people into believing that that that's what the Democrats have in store. The NHS has very little in common with Obamacare, Romneycare, or even the Canadian system. You won't hear me defending it, other than to say that my own personal experiences with it have been positive, as have my experiences with the US system (except for when they rooked my father in law). It's underfunded, and hopelessly bureaucratic, but a lot of Brits will defend it when challenged.
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There's lots wrong with socialized medical systems, but that's by design.
There's some sort of mechanism in those systems that say "we only have $X, so what level of care do we need to deliver". As Phibes says, its underfunded. But that's almost by design.
In the U.S. - insurance defaults to covering the best treatments and the cost gets pushed to the private sector. And the cost continually grows. Either you can afford it or you can't.
It's not like the average consumer can negotiate the particulars of healthcare ( doctor rates, treatments alternatives, etc). - unlike other big purchases (home, cars, etc.)
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Your first thought when you get sick or have a serious accident shouldn't be 'Oh God, can I afford this?'.
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@Larry said in Trump to unveil healthcare plan:
If only there was a way to buy insurance that paid 80% of everything until I had spent a total of 1,000 dollars and then it paid 100% of everything....
I wonder if you could sell something like that for 150 bucks a month...
This is entirely possible if the insurance company is allowed to refuse extending coverage to people who was sick, is sick, or is likely to be sick soon and is allowed to terminate coverage for any existing customer who become sick.
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@Larry said in Trump to unveil healthcare plan:
I bet they could do it if the government got out of the way......
They can do it if the government removes any regulation that prevents the insurance company from refusing coverage to people who was sick, is sick, or is likely to be sick soon and terminating coverage for any existing customer who become sick.
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A few basic trends here are the drivers:
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aging populations
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more advanced (pricey) therapies coming out everyday across all diseases
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aging populations need the most therapies
In the U.S., the standard of care is always "the best that money can buy".
So the cost of insurance is going to keep increasing - unless some insurance company out there wants to compete on different dimension (e.g., lower or more efficient standard of care) the cost will keep increasing.
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@Axtremus said in Trump to unveil healthcare plan:
@Larry said in Trump to unveil healthcare plan:
I bet they could do it if the government got out of the way......
They can do it if the government removes any regulation that prevents the insurance company from refusing coverage to people who was sick, is sick, or is likely to be sick soon and terminating coverage for any existing customer who become sick.
Nah. Do it like they used to. No pre existing coverage for the first 6 months, then it's covered.
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@taiwan_girl said in Trump to unveil healthcare plan:
@Jolly said in Trump to unveil healthcare plan:
@taiwan_girl said in Trump to unveil healthcare plan:
I think that the republics controlled BOTH the US house and senate for the first two years.
To say that Senator McCain was the only reason the new republic healthcare plan is not in place is nave. The republics had 52 people in the senate in 2016-2018. Plus control of the house PLUS the President.
@taiwan_girl said in Trump to unveil healthcare plan:
I think that the republics controlled BOTH the US house and senate for the first two years.
To say that Senator McCain was the only reason the new republic healthcare plan is not in place is nave. The republics had 52 people in the senate in 2016-2018. Plus control of the house PLUS the President.
McCain was THE deciding vote.
Do keep up, please.
He was one of many votes.
It is one thing to say to get rid of ACA, but without alternate, it is not a surprise the overall majority of the Republic Controlled Senate voted against it.
If Senator McCain were so powerful, he would have been president
God Bless you, sometimes your grasp of U.S. politics may not be as good as my grasp of Taiwan politics.
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@Copper said in Trump to unveil healthcare plan:
But if the feds were the single payer there would be unlimited money and unlimited healthcare for all
Then, since there is no limit on spending, we could get everyone a Cadillac to drive to the hospital
I want a Jaaag...With the supplied mechanic, of course.
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@xenon said in Trump to unveil healthcare plan:
There's lots wrong with socialized medical systems, but that's by design.
There's some sort of mechanism in those systems that say "we only have $X, so what level of care do we need to deliver". As Phibes says, its underfunded. But that's almost by design.
In the U.S. - insurance defaults to covering the best treatments and the cost gets pushed to the private sector. And the cost continually grows. Either you can afford it or you can't.
It's not like the average consumer can negotiate the particulars of healthcare ( doctor rates, treatments alternatives, etc). - unlike other big purchases (home, cars, etc.)
Actually, you can.
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@Jolly said in Trump to unveil healthcare plan:
@xenon said in Trump to unveil healthcare plan:
There's lots wrong with socialized medical systems, but that's by design.
There's some sort of mechanism in those systems that say "we only have $X, so what level of care do we need to deliver". As Phibes says, its underfunded. But that's almost by design.
In the U.S. - insurance defaults to covering the best treatments and the cost gets pushed to the private sector. And the cost continually grows. Either you can afford it or you can't.
It's not like the average consumer can negotiate the particulars of healthcare ( doctor rates, treatments alternatives, etc). - unlike other big purchases (home, cars, etc.)
Actually, you can.
The average consumer can have a pretty good perspective a on the size of a dwelling they want for their family of 4... the location... etc... the cost tradeoffs.
The average consumer can have a pretty good idea of how to think through similar things for a car.
How would an average consumer start to think about what they should spend on their heart disease or cancer treatment?
If they could figure that out - how much is an increased chance of survival worth?
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@xenon said in Trump to unveil healthcare plan:
@Jolly said in Trump to unveil healthcare plan:
@xenon said in Trump to unveil healthcare plan:
There's lots wrong with socialized medical systems, but that's by design.
There's some sort of mechanism in those systems that say "we only have $X, so what level of care do we need to deliver". As Phibes says, its underfunded. But that's almost by design.
In the U.S. - insurance defaults to covering the best treatments and the cost gets pushed to the private sector. And the cost continually grows. Either you can afford it or you can't.
It's not like the average consumer can negotiate the particulars of healthcare ( doctor rates, treatments alternatives, etc). - unlike other big purchases (home, cars, etc.)
Actually, you can.
The average consumer can have a pretty good perspective a on the size of a dwelling they want for their family of 4... the location... etc... the cost tradeoffs.
The average consumer can have a pretty good idea of how to think through similar things for a car.
How would an average consumer start to think about what they should spend on their heart disease or cancer treatment?
If they could figure that out - how much is an increased chance of survival worth?
Your money, your life.
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@Jolly said in Trump to unveil healthcare plan:
@xenon said in Trump to unveil healthcare plan:
@Jolly said in Trump to unveil healthcare plan:
@xenon said in Trump to unveil healthcare plan:
There's lots wrong with socialized medical systems, but that's by design.
There's some sort of mechanism in those systems that say "we only have $X, so what level of care do we need to deliver". As Phibes says, its underfunded. But that's almost by design.
In the U.S. - insurance defaults to covering the best treatments and the cost gets pushed to the private sector. And the cost continually grows. Either you can afford it or you can't.
It's not like the average consumer can negotiate the particulars of healthcare ( doctor rates, treatments alternatives, etc). - unlike other big purchases (home, cars, etc.)
Actually, you can.
The average consumer can have a pretty good perspective a on the size of a dwelling they want for their family of 4... the location... etc... the cost tradeoffs.
The average consumer can have a pretty good idea of how to think through similar things for a car.
How would an average consumer start to think about what they should spend on their heart disease or cancer treatment?
If they could figure that out - how much is an increased chance of survival worth?
Your money, your life.
Well - my last point should have - the consumer actually doesn't have the option to choose their standard of care.
It's what the doctor wants (they don't think about cost) - for prices negotiated with insurance in advance.
So yes, your money. But if you're covered, there's few other decisions you can make.
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The market allocates scarce resources to those willing to pay the most for them.
That mechanism is broken in healthcare insurance - because there's no concept of willingness to pay.
Either you're covered or not. If you're covered, it costs what it costs.
