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The New Coffee Room

  1. TNCR
  2. General Discussion
  3. It is easy to lose control

It is easy to lose control

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  • George KG Offline
    George KG Offline
    George K
    wrote on last edited by
    #4

    Difficult to see, but I have a question: Once he saw that things were going pear-shaped, why didn't he cut power and just coast out onto the grass.

    First rule of holes, and all that.

    "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

    The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

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    • MikM Offline
      MikM Offline
      Mik
      wrote on last edited by
      #5

      I had the same thought, but if it was a student they may not have thought that quickly.

      “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

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      • CopperC Offline
        CopperC Offline
        Copper
        wrote on last edited by
        #6

        That was my thought too when I first saw it.

        Just let it stop.

        But he was frozen with fear and indecision.

        He was trying to touch and go - just be on the runway for a couple seconds, then take back off.

        That is why he hit full power, then he just felt like he was committed to takeoff. It was all he could think about.

        When he was on the grass headed for the hangar he had the stick way back - he was pulling up. I think he stalled at least twice.

        Even then, I was thinking, OK, if you have to fly, keep the nose down and build some speed. But he kept the nose up and had no chance.

        I saw several CFIs comment, this is why you don't let student solos do touch & goes.

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        • George KG Offline
          George KG Offline
          George K
          wrote on last edited by
          #7

          Was the cause of this prop-torque?

          "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

          The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

          1 Reply Last reply
          • CopperC Offline
            CopperC Offline
            Copper
            wrote on last edited by Copper
            #8

            That probably contributed to it. The plane has a tendency to turn left, the prop contributes part of that tendency.

            He over-corrected and that sent him off to the right. On the ground, you steer that plane with your feet. Did you notice that just before the crash he was trying to steer to the right with the yoke?

            Steering with your feet is not a comfortable thing for beginners. I would have beginners taxi while sitting on their hands if they where having trouble getting used to steering with their feet or trying to use the yoke to steer.

            George KG 1 Reply Last reply
            • RainmanR Offline
              RainmanR Offline
              Rainman
              wrote on last edited by
              #9

              Copper, what happens to the pilot? Is he banned from ever flying again, or can he get behind the wheel if he wants to? What/who makes decisions on something like this IOW is there oversight?

              Hopefully there is oversight, seeing as how his incompetence could have crashed the plane into someone's home. I'm assuming that all the physical damage, including a totaled plane, is all covered by insurance.

              CopperC 1 Reply Last reply
              • CopperC Copper

                That probably contributed to it. The plane has a tendency to turn left, the prop contributes part of that tendency.

                He over-corrected and that sent him off to the right. On the ground, you steer that plane with your feet. Did you notice that just before the crash he was trying to steer to the right with the yoke?

                Steering with your feet is not a comfortable thing for beginners. I would have beginners taxi while sitting on their hands if they where having trouble getting used to steering with their feet or trying to use the yoke to steer.

                George KG Offline
                George KG Offline
                George K
                wrote on last edited by
                #10

                @Copper said in It is easy to lose control:

                I would have beginners taxi while sitting on their hands if they where having trouble getting used to steering with their feet

                What a great strategy. You gotta break habits.

                "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                1 Reply Last reply
                • RainmanR Rainman

                  Copper, what happens to the pilot? Is he banned from ever flying again, or can he get behind the wheel if he wants to? What/who makes decisions on something like this IOW is there oversight?

                  Hopefully there is oversight, seeing as how his incompetence could have crashed the plane into someone's home. I'm assuming that all the physical damage, including a totaled plane, is all covered by insurance.

                  CopperC Offline
                  CopperC Offline
                  Copper
                  wrote on last edited by Copper
                  #11

                  This accident was in Canada, but it is probably similar to here. This was a student pilot so the FAA might take action against the Instructor and the Student.

                  Action in this case would, at a minimum, include probably some certificate suspension and additional training - known as a 709 ride. If the FAA believes the pilot has some lack of competency they will have him get this training.

                  I have done some instruction for 709 rides. Depending on the lack of competency this might be one or more flights reviewing the area that the FAA identified. Then the FAA will reexamine the pilot with an emphasis on the problem. I believe that if you successfully complete this, the action will be removed from your record.

                  An example of a 709 ride where I did some instruction. The pilot was at an unfamiliar airport at night. He was cleared to taxi to parking. He could see the parking right in front of him. The problem was that there was a ditch between him and the parking. He didn't see the ditch until he was in it.

                  So we had a couple flights reviewing taxi procedures at the airport where it happened and reviewing procedures in general for taxiing, night flight and flight planning.

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                  • CopperC Offline
                    CopperC Offline
                    Copper
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #12

                    On the Facebook group where I found this video:

                    alt text

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • MikM Offline
                      MikM Offline
                      Mik
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #13

                      😆

                      “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

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