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The New Coffee Room

  1. TNCR
  2. General Discussion
  3. The Statement

The Statement

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved General Discussion
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  • taiwan_girlT Offline
    taiwan_girlT Offline
    taiwan_girl
    wrote on last edited by
    #4

    I am sure the situation with the shooting is not as simple as people want to say. I am sure it was not a vigilante, and I am sure that it was not 100% self-defense.

    But one thing is for certain. Same as it was for Mr. Blake, and Mr. Floyd, and this guy.

    They made some really bad choices to even put themselves in the situation where there are a good chance of bad things happening.

    George KG 1 Reply Last reply
    • taiwan_girlT taiwan_girl

      I am sure the situation with the shooting is not as simple as people want to say. I am sure it was not a vigilante, and I am sure that it was not 100% self-defense.

      But one thing is for certain. Same as it was for Mr. Blake, and Mr. Floyd, and this guy.

      They made some really bad choices to even put themselves in the situation where there are a good chance of bad things happening.

      George KG Offline
      George KG Offline
      George K
      wrote on last edited by
      #5

      @taiwan_girl said in The Statement:

      I am sure the situation with the shooting is not as simple as people want to say. I am sure it was not a vigilante, and I am sure that it was not 100% self-defense.

      He was attacked from behind, having just heard gunshots. That's reasonable fear for your life.

      They made some really bad choices to even put themselves in the situation where there are a good chance of bad things happening.

      IOW they were "asking for it?"

      But, as the NRO article said in it's last sentence on the subject, "Where the f*** were the parents?"

      "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

      The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

      taiwan_girlT 1 Reply Last reply
      • George KG George K

        @taiwan_girl said in The Statement:

        I am sure the situation with the shooting is not as simple as people want to say. I am sure it was not a vigilante, and I am sure that it was not 100% self-defense.

        He was attacked from behind, having just heard gunshots. That's reasonable fear for your life.

        They made some really bad choices to even put themselves in the situation where there are a good chance of bad things happening.

        IOW they were "asking for it?"

        But, as the NRO article said in it's last sentence on the subject, "Where the f*** were the parents?"

        taiwan_girlT Offline
        taiwan_girlT Offline
        taiwan_girl
        wrote on last edited by taiwan_girl
        #6

        @George-K said in The Statement:

        IOW they were "asking for it?"

        I think that "asking for it" is too strong.

        But if Mr. Floyed had not resisted arrest, if Mr. Blake did not walk away from the police, if Mr.Rittenhouse wasn't going around with a loaded gun in an area with high tempers, etc, what happened to those three guys would not have happened.

        The result should not have happened - so many lives changed for the worst. But, in these three case, each of them have some of the blame (no matter how small or how large that amount is.)

        That does not excuse the final result for each of them however.

        1 Reply Last reply
        • LarryL Offline
          LarryL Offline
          Larry
          wrote on last edited by
          #7

          There's no such thing as 90% self defense. You either need to defend yourself or you don't. So yes, it was 100% self defense.

          Too many people today have forgotten where our rights come from, and what role our Constitution plays in those rights. Far too many people think we get our rights FROM to Constitution. That is 100% incorrect. In fact the Constitution states quite clearly where our rights come from. The Constitution cannot and does not give you ANY rights. It can only place limits on your rights, within reason and in accordance with what we the people allow it to do. Those limits are called laws. We have a system of laws that regulate and oversee those limits. Our rights come from God. If you don't believe in God then that's fine, just think of it as our rights existing naturally.

          We have a God given (natural) right to defend ourselves from danger. The laws cannot infringe on that right. It can only set limits on how we exercise our right to defend ourselves. That limit is this: "fear for our lives". The limit the law places on your natural God given right to defend yourself is you must feel in fear for your life. I cannot come along after the fact and decide that you weren't in fear for your life - if you say you were, then by law, you were. The only other limit the law places on your right to self defense is that your response must be roughly in line with the threat. In other words, im not allowed to beat you half to death because you slapped me in the face. "Fear for your life" however is literally a legal definition which if reasoably invoked says you can kill the threat and there's nothing the law can do. The fact that the people in charge of the law are trying to prosecute is proof the Constitution is being abused.

          1. It is legal to own and carry a rifle.
          2. Why he was carrying a rifle is none of the law's business.
          3. Why he was in the area is none of the law's business.
          4. The only thing that IS the law's business is why he shot and killed someone.
          5. If he says he was in fear for his life and can show a reason for feeling that way, the law cannot do a thing.

          Period.

          George KG 1 Reply Last reply
          • CopperC Offline
            CopperC Offline
            Copper
            wrote on last edited by
            #8

            Mr. Floyd killed himself before there were any police involved.

            1 Reply Last reply
            • LarryL Offline
              LarryL Offline
              Larry
              wrote on last edited by
              #9

              By the way... one doesn't surrender his natural God given right to self defense when he puts on a police uniform.

              1 Reply Last reply
              • LarryL Larry

                There's no such thing as 90% self defense. You either need to defend yourself or you don't. So yes, it was 100% self defense.

                Too many people today have forgotten where our rights come from, and what role our Constitution plays in those rights. Far too many people think we get our rights FROM to Constitution. That is 100% incorrect. In fact the Constitution states quite clearly where our rights come from. The Constitution cannot and does not give you ANY rights. It can only place limits on your rights, within reason and in accordance with what we the people allow it to do. Those limits are called laws. We have a system of laws that regulate and oversee those limits. Our rights come from God. If you don't believe in God then that's fine, just think of it as our rights existing naturally.

                We have a God given (natural) right to defend ourselves from danger. The laws cannot infringe on that right. It can only set limits on how we exercise our right to defend ourselves. That limit is this: "fear for our lives". The limit the law places on your natural God given right to defend yourself is you must feel in fear for your life. I cannot come along after the fact and decide that you weren't in fear for your life - if you say you were, then by law, you were. The only other limit the law places on your right to self defense is that your response must be roughly in line with the threat. In other words, im not allowed to beat you half to death because you slapped me in the face. "Fear for your life" however is literally a legal definition which if reasoably invoked says you can kill the threat and there's nothing the law can do. The fact that the people in charge of the law are trying to prosecute is proof the Constitution is being abused.

                1. It is legal to own and carry a rifle.
                2. Why he was carrying a rifle is none of the law's business.
                3. Why he was in the area is none of the law's business.
                4. The only thing that IS the law's business is why he shot and killed someone.
                5. If he says he was in fear for his life and can show a reason for feeling that way, the law cannot do a thing.

                Period.

                George KG Offline
                George KG Offline
                George K
                wrote on last edited by
                #10

                @Larry said in The Statement:

                1. It is legal to own and carry a rifle.
                2. Why he was carrying a rifle is none of the law's business.
                3. Why he was in the area is none of the law's business.

                Open carry is legal in Wisconsin if you're more than 18 years old.

                He's 17, and that's a misdemeanor.

                "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                jon-nycJ 1 Reply Last reply
                • JollyJ Offline
                  JollyJ Offline
                  Jolly
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #11

                  Fine. Put him in jail for six months.

                  “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                  Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                  George KG 1 Reply Last reply
                  • JollyJ Jolly

                    Fine. Put him in jail for six months.

                    George KG Offline
                    George KG Offline
                    George K
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #12

                    @Jolly said in The Statement:

                    Fine. Put him in jail for six months.

                    Don't know what the recommended sentence is for this, but I can see some community service being appropriate.

                    But, first degree murder? GMAFB.

                    "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                    The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • taiwan_girlT Offline
                      taiwan_girlT Offline
                      taiwan_girl
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #13

                      It is interesting that in Republic of Korea, in any auto accident, there can never be only one driver at fault.

                      For example, if you are parked at a stop light waiting for the light to turn green, and someone behind you does not stop and hits you, you are partially at fault.

                      The thinking is that if you were not there, he would not have hit you. The person behind you may be found to be 99+% at fault, but it will never be 100%.

                      Kind of funny way of thinking of things. LOL

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      • George KG George K

                        @Larry said in The Statement:

                        1. It is legal to own and carry a rifle.
                        2. Why he was carrying a rifle is none of the law's business.
                        3. Why he was in the area is none of the law's business.

                        Open carry is legal in Wisconsin if you're more than 18 years old.

                        He's 17, and that's a misdemeanor.

                        jon-nycJ Offline
                        jon-nycJ Offline
                        jon-nyc
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #14

                        @George-K said in The Statement:

                        He's 17, and that's a misdemeanor.

                        According to news reports he was charged with “possession of a dangerous weapon by a person under 18” which is a felony. One of 6 felony charges he faces.

                        Only non-witches get due process.

                        • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                        George KG 1 Reply Last reply
                        • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

                          @George-K said in The Statement:

                          He's 17, and that's a misdemeanor.

                          According to news reports he was charged with “possession of a dangerous weapon by a person under 18” which is a felony. One of 6 felony charges he faces.

                          George KG Offline
                          George KG Offline
                          George K
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #15

                          @jon-nyc So, by that standard anyone under the age of 18 who carries a rifle in public could be charged with a felony.

                          Is that correct?

                          "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                          The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          • jon-nycJ Offline
                            jon-nycJ Offline
                            jon-nyc
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #16

                            All I know is what I saw listed as his charges. I don’t know how the law works in practice.

                            Google “rittenhouse charges” and see for yourself.

                            Only non-witches get due process.

                            • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                            LuFins DadL 1 Reply Last reply
                            • jon-nycJ Offline
                              jon-nycJ Offline
                              jon-nyc
                              wrote on last edited by jon-nyc
                              #17

                              Wow, the fact that the gun was illegally in his possession fucks him on every single charge.

                              7B26A68C-C172-4F3E-A6CE-EA1DEDE4D031.png

                              https://bloximages.chicago2.vip.townnews.com/journaltimes.com/content/tncms/assets/v3/editorial/4/6f/46ff33b7-0bd7-55e6-8f2f-9ded0582862f/5f4933274cde9.pdf.pdf

                              Only non-witches get due process.

                              • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                              1 Reply Last reply
                              • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

                                All I know is what I saw listed as his charges. I don’t know how the law works in practice.

                                Google “rittenhouse charges” and see for yourself.

                                LuFins DadL Offline
                                LuFins DadL Offline
                                LuFins Dad
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #18

                                @jon-nyc said in The Statement:

                                All I know is what I saw listed as his charges. I don’t know how the law works in practice.

                                Google “rittenhouse charges” and see for yourself.

                                I did. The first link - “ Rittenhouse is accused of killing Anthony Huber, 26, of Silver Lake; and Joseph Rosenbaum, 36, of Kenosha. The Illinois teenager also faces felony charges of attempted first-degree intentional homicide and two charges of first-degree recklessly endangering safety, and a misdemeanor charge of possession of a dangerous weapon by a person under 18.”

                                https://journaltimes.com/news/local/read-the-criminal-charges-filed-against-kyle-rittenhouse/article_58490a6a-f25d-51fc-b2d1-a7d58ac685b1.html

                                The Brad

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                • jon-nycJ Offline
                                  jon-nycJ Offline
                                  jon-nyc
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #19

                                  Yep. My link has it as a misdemeanor.

                                  Funny, when I posted that to George all I had read was this Foxnews piece:

                                  https://www.foxnews.com/us/charges-filed-rittenhouse-kenosha-shootings

                                  Kenosha County District Attorney Michael Graveley filed the charges against Kyle Rittenhouse, which include one count of first-degree intentional homicide; one count of first-degree reckless homicide; one count of attempted first-degree intentional homicide; two counts of first-degree reckless endangerment and one count of possession of a dangerous weapon by a person under 18, all felonies, according to court records obtained by Fox News.

                                  Only non-witches get due process.

                                  • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
                                  RainmanR 1 Reply Last reply
                                  • jon-nycJ jon-nyc

                                    Yep. My link has it as a misdemeanor.

                                    Funny, when I posted that to George all I had read was this Foxnews piece:

                                    https://www.foxnews.com/us/charges-filed-rittenhouse-kenosha-shootings

                                    Kenosha County District Attorney Michael Graveley filed the charges against Kyle Rittenhouse, which include one count of first-degree intentional homicide; one count of first-degree reckless homicide; one count of attempted first-degree intentional homicide; two counts of first-degree reckless endangerment and one count of possession of a dangerous weapon by a person under 18, all felonies, according to court records obtained by Fox News.

                                    RainmanR Offline
                                    RainmanR Offline
                                    Rainman
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #20

                                    @jon-nyc said in The Statement:

                                    Yep. My link has it as a misdemeanor.

                                    Funny, when I posted that to George all I had read was this Foxnews piece:

                                    https://www.foxnews.com/us/charges-filed-rittenhouse-kenosha-shootings

                                    Kenosha County District Attorney Michael Graveley filed the charges against Kyle Rittenhouse, which include one count of first-degree intentional homicide; one count of first-degree reckless homicide; one count of attempted first-degree intentional homicide; two counts of first-degree reckless endangerment and one count of possession of a dangerous weapon by a person under 18, all felonies, according to court records obtained by Fox News.

                                    Jon, you're reading Fox News and driving a Vette.
                                    You're coming around guy, you just don't realize it yet.
                                    Next thing you know, you'll start looking at polished cowboy boots, maybe start shaving like every 4-5 days only, get a pair of those expensive Gucci sunglasses, baseball cap with "Earn It" on the front, swiss army knife on your keychain, wallet made out of alligator hide, eat ribs for breakfast, find Ax confusing, learn to spit.

                                    We'll keep working at it. Only a matter of time.

                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    • George KG Offline
                                      George KG Offline
                                      George K
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #21

                                      This is CNN NPR::

                                      "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

                                      The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

                                      1 Reply Last reply
                                      • JollyJ Offline
                                        JollyJ Offline
                                        Jolly
                                        wrote on last edited by Jolly
                                        #22

                                        Want to defund something?

                                        How about NPR?

                                        “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                                        Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        • RainmanR Offline
                                          RainmanR Offline
                                          Rainman
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #23

                                          "If I had a son. . . "

                                          1 Reply Last reply
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