Voice of America

[xenon]

@Horace said in Voice of America:

when Russia or China likes something Trump does, it's proof that Trump is bad. When they don't like something Trump does, it's proof that Trump is bad. Either way, those who care most about what other countries think, are those who hate Donald Trump. And that stands to reason.

You say that as if it’s bad or useless to care about what other countries think. (To the extent that a country can think)

I’d rephrase it as, Trump doesn’t realize how America’s place in the world uniquely advantages America

[Horace]

@xenon said in Voice of America:

@Horace said in Voice of America:

when Russia or China likes something Trump does, it's proof that Trump is bad. When they don't like something Trump does, it's proof that Trump is bad. Either way, those who care most about what other countries think, are those who hate Donald Trump. And that stands to reason.

You say that as if it’s bad or useless to care about what other countries think. (To the extent that a country can think)

I’d rephrase it as, Trump doesn’t realize how America’s place in the world uniquely advantages America

Economically, sure. Reports of the rest of the world being very disappointed in our moral standing, on the other hand, and how meaningful that is, well, the alleged importance of that is really convenient for certain rhetorical points, and that's about all I'll give it.

[xenon]

I think it matters in the very long run - the same way it matters if we have baseline morals across society within a country.

[taiwan_girl]

@xenon said in Voice of America:

I think it matters in the very long run - the same way it matters if we have baseline morals across society within a country.

Agree.

[Jolly]

Good.

Then let's return to the Judeo-Christian values and the Puritan work ethic of a previous day in America.

[xenon]

Would be nice. The current guy ain’t quite there.

[Jolly]

Better than the half-dead POS we had in their the last four years.

[Doctor Phibes]

You know, I go to work every day, just as I have for the last 36 years. I don't need people telling me how to behave of an evening. I like a beer and a bit of rhythmic music. I've been known to use naughty words.

The Puritans can suck my dick.

[Jolly]

@Doctor-Phibes said in Voice of America:

You know, I go to work every day, just as I have for the last 36 years. I don't need people telling me how to behave of an evening. I like a beer and a bit of rhythmic music. I've been known to use naughty words.

The Puritans can suck my dick.

First, they'd have to find it. 🫣

[xenon]

I think having a clear set of ideals - at a personal, family, community, country level - is desirable.

It’s really hard to come up with them yourself, and even if you do it’s hard to get others to agree to them.

I don’t like Trump because he’s tearing down norms left, right and center. They can’t be rebuilt. I don’t see much of an upside to this from him that we wouldn’t have gotten from a vanilla republican.

Living up to values is a separate topic from having them. You could say that politicians are phony… but I see a phony politician with high ideals as better than a genuine bastard.

[Jolly]

@xenon said in Voice of America:

I think having a clear set of ideals - at a personal, family, community, country level - is desirable.

It’s really hard to come up with them yourself, and even if you do it’s hard to get others to agree to them.

I don’t like Trump because he’s tearing down norms left, right and center. They can’t be rebuilt. I don’t see much of an upside to this from him that we wouldn’t have gotten from a vanilla republican.

Living up to values is a separate topic from having them. You could say that politicians are phony… but I see a phony politician with high ideals as better than a genuine bastard.

A small truth for you...An unelected politician has very, very little actual power.

Name me a GOP politician you think could have effectively challenged Trump?

[xenon]

No one. He clearly won. I think that’s lamentable - more so because of what it says about us.

[Horace]

It says very little about us that it would have said if the price of eggs had been a few dollars cheaper. We are talking about 1 in 100 people shifting their vote from Biden 2020 to Trump 2024. What does it say about us? Are we letting those 1 in 100 people, who are probably not particularly politically engaged anyway, speak for us? I think people can get way too in their own heads and hearts about how important their feelings are about politics and the world order. A different politician is not more than a few dollars in the price of eggs away, in four years. Then we can continue worrying about how devastating the wake of Trump continues to be, all those norms that can never be reconstructed, while the less politically engaged people notice nothing in their lives that is different with or without these norms.

[Jolly]

Or what it says about you?

I don't think many of the people who voted for Trump thought he hung the moon. They were well aware of his shortcomings.

I think many today do not agree with some of his actions. But Trump is actually doing something. You may not like it, but things are happening...Things he said he would do.

1. The Border is much tighter.
2. Violent illegal immigrants are being deported.
3. The government is being trimmed down.
4. Ukraine and Russia have a ceasefire and hopefully, peace.
5. The U.S. is supporting Israel and not Hamas.
6. We are pursuing a strategy for job creation in material production, energy production and manufacturing. It may not be the right strategy, but at least we are doing something.
7. We are trying to return to a less politicized justice system.

[xenon]

I’d take issue with a bunch of things on your list - some more than others - but that’s a different topic.

I think we’re talking about the “how” not the “what”. I’m not a “by any means necessary” sort of guy.

Especially when this is the best positioned country in the world. Americans have a severe lack of perspective and gratitude for what came before them.

[jon-nyc]

4 and 7 are objectively false.

[Horace]

@jon-nyc said in Voice of America:

4 and 7 are objectively false.

Objectively false that we are "trying to return to a less politicized justice system"? How would you elaborate on that objective truth?

[Jolly]

@jon-nyc said in Voice of America:

4 and 7 are objectively false.

I think we are very close to a ceasefire.

Wasn't there a prisoner exchange today?

[jon-nyc]

How many GOP AUSAs have resigned after being asked to politicize their role? I can think of three off the top of my head. How many threats has Ed Martin made to political adversaries? Did you see what they did to Paul Weiss? Who’s next?

[Wim]

@Jolly Prisoner swap: yes.
Cease fire? Nope.