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The New Coffee Room

  1. TNCR
  2. General Discussion
  3. Is it 1940 France?

Is it 1940 France?

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  • JollyJ Offline
    JollyJ Offline
    Jolly
    wrote on last edited by
    #3

    Most of the world wouldn't care if China invaded Taiwan this morning.

    Oh, you'd have the usual eyewash and handwringing, but that would be about it.

    “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

    Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

    taiwan_girlT 1 Reply Last reply
    • JollyJ Jolly

      Most of the world wouldn't care if China invaded Taiwan this morning.

      Oh, you'd have the usual eyewash and handwringing, but that would be about it.

      taiwan_girlT Offline
      taiwan_girlT Offline
      taiwan_girl
      wrote on last edited by
      #4

      @Jolly said in Is it 1940 France?:

      Most of the world wouldn't care if China invaded Taiwan this morning.

      Oh, you'd have the usual eyewash and handwringing, but that would be about it.

      I am not sure about that.

      The other thread about TSMC and the making of semi conductors is a pretty good reason the above would hopefully not happen.

      There was stuff in the local Taiwan papers about how TMSC has booby traps in all their factories so if there is an invasion, they will not allow the technology to be usable by the mainland Chinese.

      RenaudaR 1 Reply Last reply
      • MikM Offline
        MikM Offline
        Mik
        wrote on last edited by
        #5

        I wondered if they might do that. Make the island useless to CCP.

        “I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill

        1 Reply Last reply
        • taiwan_girlT taiwan_girl

          @Jolly said in Is it 1940 France?:

          Most of the world wouldn't care if China invaded Taiwan this morning.

          Oh, you'd have the usual eyewash and handwringing, but that would be about it.

          I am not sure about that.

          The other thread about TSMC and the making of semi conductors is a pretty good reason the above would hopefully not happen.

          There was stuff in the local Taiwan papers about how TMSC has booby traps in all their factories so if there is an invasion, they will not allow the technology to be usable by the mainland Chinese.

          RenaudaR Offline
          RenaudaR Offline
          Renauda
          wrote on last edited by Renauda
          #6

          @taiwan_girl

          The 21st Century equivalent to scuttling your ships or spiking your guns.

          The Germans did similar to their factories and infrastructure In 1945 as the Red Army advanced into Germany.

          Elbows up!

          1 Reply Last reply
          • X Offline
            X Offline
            xenon
            wrote on last edited by xenon
            #7

            Yeah - besides the whole international tech sector burning to the ground, no one would care about Taiwan getting invaded.

            1 Reply Last reply
            • JollyJ Offline
              JollyJ Offline
              Jolly
              wrote on last edited by
              #8

              You don't think the Chinese would:

              A. Capture the factories intact.
              B. Already possess the intellectual property.
              C. Possibly already have a factory built.

              Never assume your opponent is stupid.

              “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

              Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

              1 Reply Last reply
              • X Offline
                X Offline
                xenon
                wrote on last edited by xenon
                #9

                American workers - who work in silicon manufacturing - are not nearly as productive as Taiwanese workers in the same space.

                Handing a silicon factory over to rando chinese silicon workers is like handing me a space shuttle.

                A single cutting edge factory can cost 12 figures. There was a famous case of a parking lot repaint in an American fab that messed up yields inside the fab.

                These things are insanely complex. These are the machines that make the most complicated machines we have.

                The cycle time to set up new silicon capacity and nodes is years. The supply chain disruption of covid will look like child's play next to this. That's assuming the Chinese could somehow salvage and work the factories.

                1 Reply Last reply
                • JollyJ Offline
                  JollyJ Offline
                  Jolly
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #10

                  Forced labor at the end of a bayonet work?

                  “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                  Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  • X Offline
                    X Offline
                    xenon
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #11

                    And Apple, nvidia, qualcomm and AMD will continue to push through orders to them and work with their engineers day in day out with the bayonets visible in the zoom calls?

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • JollyJ Offline
                      JollyJ Offline
                      Jolly
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #12

                      You think the Chinese are that stupid?

                      “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                      Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      • X Offline
                        X Offline
                        xenon
                        wrote on last edited by xenon
                        #13

                        I'm obviously being tongue in cheek.

                        TSMC makes chips pretty much exclusively for American companies - at least for the important stuff. Do you think that would actually continue even if by some miracle the Chinese could keep operations going?

                        There is also no universe in which it doesn't take less than 5 years to decouple from TSMC (that's assuming there existed a viable alternative today - Intel ain't it yet - all the engineers started porting over to that toolset, and ground breaks on new fabs).

                        Again - it looks like economic suicide for all involved to me. But maybe you think China gets to invade Taiwan and American companies would hand over our most advanced semiconductor IP to them.

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        • JollyJ Offline
                          JollyJ Offline
                          Jolly
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #14

                          If the Chinese will weld their own people into buildings and tell them breathe or die, I suspect they wouldn't bat an eyelash at a little economic turmoil.

                          “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                          Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

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