An Experiment

[George K]

SCOTUS will not block execution:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-68089279

The US Supreme Court will not block Alabama from executing Kenneth Eugene Smith with nitrogen gas, a method never used before for capital punishment.
Smith had asked the court to intervene, saying that the execution was cruel and unusual punishment.
The execution, where toxic nitrogen will be pumped into his body through a mask, is planned for Thursday.
Alabama already tried to execute Smith by lethal injection two years ago for his 1989 murder conviction.
His scheduled execution could still be delayed while judges in the 11th US Circuit Court of Appeals consider a separate case Smith filed.
The three-judge panel heard arguments last Friday, but did not indicate when it would issue a ruling.
Smith's lawyers had filed the appeal with the lower court citing "untested methods".
Smith would be the first person in the US to face nitrogen gassing.

"Toxic nitrogen"

Um, hey journalists! It's 79% of every breath you take.

[Jolly]

Hang him and be done with it. Cheap, simple and the components are reusable.

[taiwan_girl]

To me, nitrogen is the way to go. Whether the death penalty is something the US should have is another question. But I think that nitrogen is less cruel than other methods.

[George K]

@taiwan_girl said in An Experiment:

I think that nitrogen is less cruel than other methods.

That seems to be the argument with which opponents disagree. They cite cases of animals asphyxiated with N2 - convulsions and vomiting occur.

Frankly, I don't understand the objection (putting aside the capital punishment basis). If you're going to kill someone, and they are unconscious, are seizures, vomiting, etc "cruel and unusual."

Yes, they are unseemly, and upsetting to those who watch, but as far as the subject is concerned, it's irrelevant.

[taiwan_girl]

@George-K Agree.

[George K]

@George-K said in An Experiment:

"cruel and unusual."

Remember, the other guy who was convicted of this murder was executed years ago. The only reason this one has taken so long is because the executioners were unable to find a vein for lethal injection. They spent two hours.

Should've called me.

[Renauda]

I thought N2 just displaced oxygen and eternal sleep sets in.

[George K]

@Renauda said in An Experiment:

I thought N2 just displaced oxygen and eternal sleep sets in.

My understanding as well. Not sure if O2 is "displaced," but death occurs by hypoxia which induces unconsciousness.

[Copper]

I believe Costco now uses nitrogen to fill the tires it sells.

I wonder if the victim's nitrogen could serve at the execution, assuming the victim had nitrogen.

The family might enjoy it.

[taiwan_girl]

@Copper said in An Experiment:

I believe Costco now uses nitrogen to fill the tires it sells.

I think that is a scam. A scientist friend told me that the size difference in the molecule in no way justify the increased cost to fill a wheel.

[Renauda]

@taiwan_girl

Might make a difference on racing car tires but on a personal transportation vehicle, nothing at all. I agree it’s a scam.

[George K]

@taiwan_girl said in An Experiment:

I think that is a scam.

The only advantage for non-racing car drivers is that the larger molecule, theoretically, leaks out of the surface slower, allowing the tire to keep full inflation longer.

OTOH, you have to wonder how much of difference replacing 21% of the gas in a tire with pure N2 really makes.

[Copper]

@taiwan_girl said in An Experiment:

@Copper said in An Experiment:

I believe Costco now uses nitrogen to fill the tires it sells.

I think that is a scam. A scientist friend told me that the size difference in the molecule in no way justify the increased cost to fill a wheel.

I hate to judge without all the facts, but it sounds like your scientist friend does not understand. Nitrogen in the tires doesn't guarantee no leaks, but it does change the nature of leaks depending on several physical conditions. In general, it will not leak as fast.

Nitrogen does not behave the same as plain old atmospheric air. I'm sure we can all agree on that.

For one thing, I doubt anyone has proposed to carry out corporal punishment with plain old air.

Is Nitrogen in tires worth the trouble or expense? Sometimes.

I don't think that Costco charges extra for nitrogen, where is the scam?

AAA likes nitrogen

https://www.aaa.com/autorepair/articles/top-4-myths-vs-facts-about-using-nitrogen-to-inflate-car-tires

[taiwan_girl]

@Copper said in An Experiment:

I don't think that Costco charges extra for nitrogen, where is the scam?

Agree. If there is no extra cost, then for sure not a scam. But I have hear that a lot of places charge extra to fill with nitrogen.

Using a bicycle pump and arm power is free also if you are not near a Coscto. LOL

[Copper]

@taiwan_girl said in An Experiment:

But I have hear that a lot of places charge extra to fill with nitrogen.

A few months ago, I stopped at a gas station in Denver and paid $2 to fill my tires, not with nitrogen, with plain old air. The pump took a credit card.

[George K]

@Copper said in An Experiment:

I hate to judge without all the facts, but it sounds like your scientist friend does not understand. Nitrogen in the tires doesn't guarantee no leaks, but it does change the nature of leaks depending on several physical conditions. In general, it will not leak as fast.

Nitrogen does not behave the same as plain old atmospheric air. I'm sure we can all agree on that.

No, we can't. Atmospheric air is 79% nitrogen. Perhaps not "the same," but darn close. The difference in molecular weight (14 vs 16) is small. So a small difference in 21% of the sample. Perhaps the water vapor in atmospheric air makes a difference, but see below...

Is Nitrogen in tires worth the trouble or expense? Sometimes.

When?

AAA likes nitrogen

https://www.aaa.com/autorepair/articles/top-4-myths-vs-facts-about-using-nitrogen-to-inflate-car-tires

Er..

• both oxygen and nitrogen escape at the same rate.
• nitrogen does not completely eliminate temperature-related pressure changes under normal driving conditions
• Even tires filled with nitrogen still require regular pressure checks to identify slow leaks
• Compressed air systems at most tire shops have moisture separators that limit the amount of water vapor in the compressed air supply. Limiting water vapor protects the tires and wheels as well as a shop's expensive air-powered tire mounting and installation tools.

[Renauda]

Nitrogen escapes from tires just as fast as regular air does if the bead fails when temperatures get below -25 C. Single biggest problem next to dead batteries with cars here in winter.

[Axtremus]

@George-K said in An Experiment:

The only reason this one has taken so long is because the executioners were unable to find a vein for lethal injection. They spent two hours.

Should've called me.

Do you charge by the hour or by piece?
Can they afford you?

Also curious ... do you have to be certified to carry out the procedure to fulfill a death sentence? If so, what is that certification?

[George K]

@Axtremus said in An Experiment:

Do you charge by the hour or by piece?

Yes

Can they afford you?

No

Probably, now that I'm retired and I could use a little walking-around cash.

Also curious ... do you have to be certified to carry out the procedure to fulfill a death sentence? If so, what is that certification?

No clue.

[Copper]

@George-K said in An Experiment:

Is Nitrogen in tires worth the trouble or expense? Sometimes.

When?

When the expense is zero.
When the trouble is zero.
See the AAA for more.

@George-K said in An Experiment:

Perhaps not "the same,"

Yes, exactly.