More prostate cancer
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@George-K said in More prostate cancer:
@nobodyssock said in More prostate cancer:
ok, what is the big risk of giving a little blood?
It's a sinister cancer. I've seen a couple of fathers of friends of mine die in a slow agony.
Back around 10 years or so ago, a "study" came out indicating that the risk of getting the blood test would cause untoward "anxiety" and unnecessary procedures. So, the PSA's weren't done.
Kenny, when he was diagnosed around that time urged everyone to get tested - he had a PSA of about 3.5.
So, in the interest of preventing unnecessary procedures and anxiety, thousands of lives were jepoardized.
Don't forget the line about most men will die from something else.
Always remember, Operation Valkyrie was an act of sedition.
Warning: I post things that interest me. Read and comment at your own discretion. -
@Jolly said in More prostate cancer:
Don't forget the line about most men will die from something else.
As a point of fact, that's true, as far as it goes. More men than not, by the time they die of a heart attack or stroke, will have evidence of prostate CA. However, what I'm seeing here is that potentially serious cases were missed.
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You can get one for as cheap as $28.00. I think average is 49.
https://www.findlabtest.com/lab-test/cancer-screening/total-psa-test-cost-quest-5363
I paid for one.
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Not that I completely agree, but here's another view:
https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/cross-check/why-i-wont-get-a-psa-test-for-prostate-cancer/
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I think we need to make a distinction between dying ‘of’ prostate cancer and dying ‘with’ prostate cancer,
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@QuantumIvory said in More prostate cancer:
Not that I completely agree, but here's another view:
https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/cross-check/why-i-wont-get-a-psa-test-for-prostate-cancer/
He's wrong.
Used correctly, the test has a lot of worth. It needs to be a good test ( for many years the Hybritech-linked technology was the gold standard), and sequential tests need to be done by the same methodology. A positive result and rising levels do need follow up, including biopsy.
Guys do die from this. The PSA does provide a screening test that may just keep you alive.
Always remember, Operation Valkyrie was an act of sedition.
Warning: I post things that interest me. Read and comment at your own discretion. -
@jon-nyc said in More prostate cancer:
I think we need to make a distinction between dying ‘of’ prostate cancer and dying ‘with’ prostate cancer,
Which is, basically what I said.
However, the article points out, "he incidence of advanced cancers that had spread beyond the prostate gland — known as regional-stage or distant-stage cancers — increased at “an alarming rate,” Jemal told NBC News.
For instance, among men 50 to 74, the incidence of distant-stage, metastatic cancers increased by 2.4 percent per year from 2008 to 2012 and by 5.6 percent per year from 2012 to 2016. Among men 75 and older, the incidence of distant-stage disease increased by 5.2 percent per year from 2010 to 2016."
And this:
Dr. Edward Schaeffer, chair of urology at Northwestern University Feinberg School of Medicine, said the new study adds to earlier research, including his own 2016 study, that raised concerns about an increasing incidence of advanced prostate cancer.
Though the explanation is unclear and could potentially include environmental, lifestyle or other factors, he said he believes the changing screening guidelines were a driving factor. “When you relax screening, these are the downstream effects,” he said. “There are more cancers that show up in a more advanced stage.”
Schaeffer says that because aggressive cancers are so deadly when they spread, he advises men to talk with their doctors about the best time to get PSA screening.
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@Jolly said in More prostate cancer:
@QuantumIvory said in More prostate cancer:
Not that I completely agree, but here's another view:
https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/cross-check/why-i-wont-get-a-psa-test-for-prostate-cancer/
He's wrong.
.That guy's been wrong about a lot of things.
From Wiki:
"His October 1993 Scientific American article, "The Death of Proof", claimed that the growing complexity of mathematics, combined with "computer proofs" and other developments, were undermining traditional concepts of mathematical proof. The article generated "torrents of howls and complaints" from mathematicians, according to David Hoffman (one of the mathematicians Horgan interviewed for the article).[2] In response to this article, the Horgan surface is, sarcastically, named after him. It is a speculated embedded minimal surface whose existence is strongly suggested by computers but doubted by many mathematicians. The non-existence of the Horgan surface is later established rigorously through a mathematical proof,[3] completing the sarcasm with the term "Horgan non-surface"."
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Ahoy folks. Am sitting here sipping a cup tea after a walk around the block and emptying the litre of urine from the small leg bag that I wear during the day. Last Thursday, 11 June, I had the dubious pleasure of undergoing a robotic radical prostatectomy and lymph node dissection.
Spent that night in the hospital (first time other than birth) and was sent home Friday to convalesce. Haven't had the need or taken a pain med since coming home. I drink daily of what seems gallons of water and cranberry juice and have a minimum of 4 walks a day around the block. Thursday I go to the clinic to have a couple of annoying staples removed from the lower right side of my abdomen and, on the 25 June I go back to have the ever so pleasant catheter removed. I then begin to learn how to use my pelvic shelf muscles so as not to wet my pants continually being that nature's check valve, the prostate, beneath my bladder has been removed. Women of course learn how to use pelvic shelf muscles to control their bladder when they are toddlers. Boys do not, or at least not very efficiently.
I am at this stage because of judicious screening. Nine years ago I lost a close childhood friend, four years younger than me, to an aggressive prostate cancer. From his hospital bed he would admonish all his friends who visited to be sure to insist on a PSA test in addition to the routine rectal examine during annual check ups. It was never an issue with my GP, in fact for her bloodwork for all male patients over 45 was always offered and for those like me over 50, it was routine. Two years ago that screen indicated that my PSA was elevated to 7. She prescribed Flomox and said to get another test in three months. After three months i did another test and my PSA had dropped to 4. Last spring we repeated the process and my PSA had crept back up this time 6.8. She then referred me to a urologist. I went to see him the end of May last year and he undertook the usual rectal examine and recommended a biospy. The biopsy showed a localised presence of Gleason 5 cells. That meant that I had present the least aggressive prostate cancer and that at this stage the recommended treatment would be a programme of active monitoring. That is essentially a PSA test every three months. He also ordered a MRI to be performed three months on once the prostate had healed from the ravages of the late August biopsy. The MRI was performed beginning of December and indicated that a little garden of cells were missed in the biopsy. He then ordered yet another biopsy this time targetting the area the MRI detected. Biopsy 2 (20 samples BTW) was performed the beginning of March, the day before the first COVID case was reported here. Sure enough it discovered that the target area was incubating a slightly more aggressive cancer bringing me up to a Gleason 6. The Doc felt that we should now cease the active monitoring and take action.
I had two options given the pathology. I could do the surgery or undergo radiation treatment. Both had greater than 90% chance of success. I weighed the two, I chose the surgery. I felt that it offered the best long term outcomes since if at any time down the road, my PSA starts to climb again, i can undergo radiation treatment. Had i selected radiation now surgery would no longer be a future option. I won't go into the details as to why that is case - too many argumentative arm chair experts here- but am sure that the very competent resident docs, especially bach, would be able to explain it better than I.
So i got the phone call on 3 June for surgery on the 11th.
So guys....Insist on a regular PSA test. Do not wait until such time that you are either peeing blood or not able to pee at all before seeing the doc.
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Always remember, Operation Valkyrie was an act of sedition.
Warning: I post things that interest me. Read and comment at your own discretion. -
A couple of years ago I had a Biopsy when I had a PSA of 4. Last year, I had a PSA of 9. It went down in a second test - but still elevated. I'm due again. One of my brothers has had prostate cancer, and I anticipate that I will as well. Brother did the radiation route. Reminds me to schedule another PSA.
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"Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08
The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.
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Thanks for the sobering news. I need to make sure I get these tests, since I'm unfortunately the type where "ignore it, and it will go away" covers everything.
Good to hear from you, Renauda. You always had a unique and informed perspective, I always enjoyed reading your thoughts on various issues, and learned from them.
Best of luck in all future tests and pokes. Makes me cringe, but you are of course right in being proactive and knowledgeable about what's going on with your health.
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A couple of points I would like to add. Comments I commonly heard from male colleagues, friends and acquaintances when i told them the details of my initial diagnosis, went along the lines of:
"I'm too busy to get the test"
"I am not ready to hear the news if it comes back with a high score."
"I don't have any trouble peeing so i don't see the need."
"My father didn't have it so I am not concerned."
"A cancer diagnosis would freak me out, i wouldn't be able to sleep or eat."
All i can say is that when I got the confirmed diagnosis last August It didn't phase me and i never thought twice about it after. Even when the more aggressive cells were confirmed in March, it didn't worry me. Why? Because the urologist felt confident from my first visit that all the right screening steps were taken within a reasonable timeframe to ensure a postive outcome once the time to act was evident. Not once did I ever think that all was bad news from the doctors. In fact i specifically remember saying to the urologist when he explained my Gleason 5 diagnosis, "well, that's good news" and we moved forward.
To me it has been nothing more than an inconvenience. And for the record, my father lived to 91 years. He never had prostate cancer and I remember from his medical records he did screen annually.
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"Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08
The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.
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@George-K Sadly, that was spewed from the mouth of an individual who in real life is perhaps the most unproductive workaholic narcissist and micro-managing nano bourgeois shopkeeper I have ever in encountered in a workplace in 45 years.
Everything about him was BS. Was glad when COVID 19 closed his doors in March.
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Sorry to hear you're going through this, but very glad they caught it, Renauda.
There's really no excuse not to have the screening. Admittedly, I put off the colonoscopy for a couple of years when I turned 50, but that was mostly due to me dreading the process. As it happens, it was a good job I got it done, for peace of mind and polyp removal if nothing else.
(In case you don't know - the poster formerly known as D'Oh)
