Are they angling for an appearance in Tucker?
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@jon-nyc said in Are they angling for an appearance in Tucker?:
Yep. Both were Useful Idiots, the original America First crowd for Hitler, today’s for Putin and perhaps Xi.
Go educate yourself.
As late as early 1941, 85% of Americans agreed with a central belief of the America First movement - namely, that Amercans have no business in foreign wars. And AF was not a group of ultra nationalists, but rather a bunch of folks from all political backgrounds that agreed with nonintervention.
Remember, at that time we were only one generation removed from the horrors of The Great War. Over 116,000 Americans dead. Also, people remembered what Washington had said about foreign entanglements.
I support supplying arms to Ukraine. I do worry about weapons stockpiles and readiness...It has long been the goal of the U.S. to be able to fight in two theaters at the same time, if necessary.
But America First is a strategic position. You can disagree, but the ridicule says a lot more about you than it does Tucker. I think it would behoove you to make a better argument against his position.
@Jolly said in Are they angling for an appearance in Tucker?:
@jon-nyc said in Are they angling for an appearance in Tucker?:
Yep. Both were Useful Idiots, the original America First crowd for Hitler, today’s for Putin and perhaps Xi.
Go educate yourself.
As late as early 1941, 85% of Americans agreed with a central belief of the America First movement - namely, that Amercans have no business in foreign wars. And AF was not a group of ultra nationalists, but rather a bunch of folks from all political backgrounds that agreed with nonintervention.
Remember, at that time we were only one generation removed from the horrors of The Great War. Over 116,000 Americans dead. Also, people remembered what Washington had said about foreign entanglements.
I support supplying arms to Ukraine. I do worry about weapons stockpiles and readiness...It has long been the goal of the U.S. to be able to fight in two theaters at the same time, if necessary.
But America First is a strategic position. You can disagree, but the ridicule says a lot more about you than it does Tucker. I think it would behoove you to make a better argument against his position.
To paraphrase Oscar Wilde, getting it completely fucking wrong once may be regarded as misfortune. To do so twice seems like carelessness.
If you want to be a world power, isolationism isn't going to cut it.
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Reconstitute the British Empire and police the world, mate.
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@Jolly said in Are they angling for an appearance in Tucker?:
Reconstitute the British Empire and police the world, mate.
We've had our 15 minutes. It's your turn.
Do you honestly think that isolation is a good idea?
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In the early days of Hitler, there was more than one American citizen that admired the job he did, pulling Germany out of a bad depression. The Weimar Republic died, as Hitler consolidated his power and started to go outside of its constitution.
I suspect by the time Hitler invaded Poland, most Americans had ceased to admire him and probably thought he should be stopped, but stopped using European soldiers, not American soldiers.
An interesting thought exercise revolves around America's entry into WW2...What if Hitler had not declared war on the U.S.? Would the U.S. have declared war on Germany?
I suspect by the time Hitler invaded Poland, most Americans had ceased to admire him and probably thought he should be stopped, but stopped using European soldiers, not American soldiers.
That is correct. Two realities of Nazism caused people to change their minds. First was the brutality of Nazism with regard to its persecution of Jews and other minorities under its control. The second was that Nazi involvement in the Spanish Civil War and its annexation of Czechoslovakia drove home the reality that Hitler was first and foremost a warlord tyrant.
An interesting thought exercise revolves around America's entry into WW2...What if Hitler had not declared war on the U.S.? Would the U.S. have declared war on Germany?
I suspect the US would not have until late 1942 or ‘43. FDR would have preferred focusing its resources on Lend Lease support to Britain and the USSR. The Nazis however would have eventually drawn the US into the European theatre through its U-boat attacks on US shipping.
An interesting read published in 2020, is Sean McKeen’s, Stalin’s War. Well researched and written. Among other hypotheses McKeen makes, he argues compellingly that FDR, through Harry Hopkins, was determined to provide as much Lend Lease as possible to the USSR to bring about the defeat of Hitler in Europe then involve itself directly in defeating Japan in China. Worth the read even if only for some of its revisionist historiography and examination of Harry Hopkin’s duplicity in diverting Lend Lease support away from Britain to The USSR.
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I think the ‘domino theory’ probably applies here too. If Ukraine had been a cakewalk for them I think Georgia and the Baltics and maybe even Moldova would have had a lot to fear.
"You never know what worse luck your bad luck has saved you from."
-Cormac McCarthy -
I think the ‘domino theory’ probably applies here too. If Ukraine had been a cakewalk for them I think Georgia and the Baltics and maybe even Moldova would have had a lot to fear.
@jon-nyc said in Are they angling for an appearance in Tucker?:
I think the ‘domino theory’ probably applies here too. If Ukraine had been a cakewalk for them I think Georgia and the Baltics and maybe even Moldova would have had a lot to fear.
Putin and other Russian nationalists have been very clear that their ultimate goal is to reclaim the territories lost when the the USSR dissolved and beyond into areas under Russian control during Tsarist times. Textbook imperialism that adheres to the pan-slavist doctrine of autocracy, nationality and orthodoxy with Moscow taking the mantle as the third Rome lording over all Slavic nations and cultures.
That world view reinforces the late Christopher Hitchen’s claim that had not the Bolsheviks come to power in 1917, Nazi style fascism would have emerged first in Russia in the wake of WWI and the revolution rather than Germany during the course of the 1920’s.
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@jon-nyc said in Are they angling for an appearance in Tucker?:
I think the ‘domino theory’ probably applies here too. If Ukraine had been a cakewalk for them I think Georgia and the Baltics and maybe even Moldova would have had a lot to fear.
Putin and other Russian nationalists have been very clear that their ultimate goal is to reclaim the territories lost when the the USSR dissolved and beyond into areas under Russian control during Tsarist times. Textbook imperialism that adheres to the pan-slavist doctrine of autocracy, nationality and orthodoxy with Moscow taking the mantle as the third Rome lording over all Slavic nations and cultures.
That world view reinforces the late Christopher Hitchen’s claim that had not the Bolsheviks come to power in 1917, Nazi style fascism would have emerged first in Russia in the wake of WWI and the revolution rather than Germany during the course of the 1920’s.
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Kazakhstan is a potential menu item. It was an autonomous region of Russian Soviet Republic until the Kazakh Soviet Republic was formed in 1936 under Stalin. When the USSR broke up the then predominantly ethnic Russian, Ukrainian and German areas remained with Kazakhstan. Most Germans and Ukrainians have since moved. On the other hand Russians stayed behind and have since become a minority owing government policy encouraging Kazakhs to move into the northern areas. Although Russian remains an official language alongside Kazakh throughout the country, the latter is slowly becoming the primary language of the state.
As well and perhaps more importantly, Kazakhstan has not given Moscow its unqualified support of the invasion of Ukraine. In fact it has been openly critical of Moscow’s actions. It knows only too well that it could be next should Putin decide the Russian minority there needs to be denazified.
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I am definitely the opposite of a isolationist. To me, it is a long term receipt for failure of the country.
