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The New Coffee Room

  1. TNCR
  2. General Discussion
  3. Maybe they decided to use nondeadly force. Or is that undeadly force? I'm confused.

Maybe they decided to use nondeadly force. Or is that undeadly force? I'm confused.

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  • HoraceH Offline
    HoraceH Offline
    Horace
    wrote on last edited by
    #5

    All government authority is backed by violence. Who cares whether any given individual cog carries a gun.

    Education is extremely important.

    1 Reply Last reply
    • JollyJ Jolly

      Didn't know the IRS routinely carried guns.

      I know they have stockpiled at least 5,000,000 rounds of ammo.

      IvorythumperI Offline
      IvorythumperI Offline
      Ivorythumper
      wrote on last edited by
      #6

      @Jolly said in Maybe they decided to use nondeadly force. Or is that undeadly force? I'm confused.:

      Didn't know the IRS routinely carried guns.

      I know they have stockpiled at least 5,000,000 rounds of ammo.

      A friend of mine is a retired Special Agent who worked for HUD and for VA, investigating mostly white collar fraud cases, and he carried on the job.

      1 Reply Last reply
      • JollyJ Jolly

        Didn't know the IRS routinely carried guns.

        I know they have stockpiled at least 5,000,000 rounds of ammo.

        jon-nycJ Offline
        jon-nycJ Offline
        jon-nyc
        wrote on last edited by
        #7

        @Jolly said in Maybe they decided to use nondeadly force. Or is that undeadly force? I'm confused.:

        Didn't know the IRS routinely carried guns.

        I know they have stockpiled at least 5,000,000 rounds of ammo.

        It’s not so much that “the IRS routinely carries guns”. It’s that every federal department has its own enforcement arm.

        https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_law_enforcement_in_the_United_States

        "You never know what worse luck your bad luck has saved you from."
        -Cormac McCarthy

        1 Reply Last reply
        • JollyJ Offline
          JollyJ Offline
          Jolly
          wrote on last edited by
          #8

          Why not just call a Marshal?

          “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

          Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

          1 Reply Last reply
          • jon-nycJ Offline
            jon-nycJ Offline
            jon-nyc
            wrote on last edited by
            #9

            I don’t know. But understand it isn’t just the IRS.

            Agencies in bold text are law enforcement agencies (LEAs).

            Executive Branch
            Edit
            Department of Agriculture
            Edit
            Seal of the United States Department of Agriculture
            Office of the Secretary of Agriculture
            Protective Operations Division (POD)[8]
            Office of Inspector General (USDA-OIG)
            United States Forest Service (USFS)
            U.S. Forest Service Law Enforcement & Investigations (USFS LEI)
            Department of Commerce
            Edit
            Seal of the United States Department of Commerce
            Office of Inspector General (DOC-OIG)
            Office of Security (DOC OS) US DOC Office of Security
            US Commerce Department Police
            Bureau of Industry and Security (BIS)
            Office of Export Enforcement (OEE)
            National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST)
            National Institute of Standards and Technology Police
            National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA)
            National Marine Fisheries Service (NMFS)
            Office of Law Enforcement (OLE)
            Department of Defense
            Edit
            United States Department of Defense Seal
            Office of Inspector General (DOD-OIG)
            Defense Criminal Investigative Service (DCIS)
            Pentagon Force Protection Agency (PFPA)
            United States Pentagon Police (USPPD)
            Department of Defense Police (DOD Police) ("DOD Police" refers to any civilian engaged in police duties for the DOD and the US Armed Forces).
            Defense Logistics Agency (DLA)
            Defense Logistics Agency Police
            National Security Agency (NSA)
            National Security Agency Police
            Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA)
            Defense Intelligence Agency Police
            National Geospatial-Intelligence Agency (NGA)
            National Geospatial-Intelligence Agency Police
            Department of the Army
            United States Army Criminal Investigation Division (USACID)
            United States Army Counterintelligence (ACI)
            United States Army Military Police Corps (USAMPC)
            Department of the Army Civilian Police (DACP)
            includes Department of the Army Civilian Guards (DASG)
            United States Army Corrections Command (USACC)
            Department of the Navy
            Naval Criminal Investigative Service (NCIS)
            United States Marine Corps Criminal Investigation Division (USMC CID)
            Master-at-arms (military police)
            Department of the Navy Police (civilian police)
            United States Marine Corps Military Police
            United States Marine Corps Civilian Police
            Department of the Air Force
            Department of the Air Force Office of Special Investigations (OSI)
            Air Force Security Forces Center (AFSFC)
            United States Air Force Security Forces (military police)
            Department of the Air Force Police (civilian police)
            includes Department of Air Force Civilian Guards (DAF Guard)
            Department of Education
            Edit
            Seal of the United States Department of Education
            Office of Inspector General (ED-OIG)
            Protective Service Division (ED-PSD)
            Office for Civil Rights (OCR)
            Department of Energy
            Edit
            Seal of the United States Department of Energy
            Office of Inspector General (DOE-OIG)
            Office of Health, Safety and Security (DOE-HSS)
            National Nuclear Security Administration (NNSA)
            Office of Secure Transportation (OST)
            Federal Protective Forces
            Department of Health and Human Services
            Edit
            Seal of the United States Department of Health and Human Services
            Office of Inspector General (HHS-OIG)
            United States Food and Drug Administration (HHSFDA)
            Office of Criminal Investigations (OCI)
            National Institutes of Health (NIH)
            National Institutes of Health Police
            Department of Homeland Security
            Edit
            Seal of the United States Department of Homeland Security

            CBP Officers and Border Patrol Agents at a ceremony in 2007
            Office of Inspector General (DHS-OIG)
            Federal Protective Service (FPS)
            Federal Law Enforcement Training Centers (FLETC)
            Office of the Chief Security Officer (OCSO)
            United States Coast Guard (USCG)
            Coast Guard Investigative Service (CGIS)
            United States Coast Guard Police (CGPD)
            United States Customs and Border Protection (CBP)
            United States Border Patrol (USBP)
            CBP Air and Marine Operations (AMO)
            CBP Office of Field Operations (OFO)
            Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA)
            Mount Weather Emergency Operations Center
            Mount Weather Emergency Operations Center Police
            Office of Chief Security Officer (OCSO)
            United States Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE)
            Homeland Security Investigations (HSI)
            Enforcement Removal Operations (ERO)
            Office of Intelligence
            Office of Professional Responsibility (OPR)
            United States Secret Service (USSS)
            United States Secret Service Uniformed Division (USSS UD)
            Transportation Security Administration (TSA)
            Office of Law Enforcement (OLE)/Federal Air Marshal Service (FAMS)
            Federal Flight Deck Officer (FFDO)
            Office of Inspection (OI)
            United States Citizenship and Immigration Services (USCIS)
            Fraud Detection and National Security Directorate (FDNS)
            Department of Housing and Urban Development
            Edit
            Seal of the United States Department of Housing and Urban Development
            Office of Inspector General (HUD-OIG)
            Protective Service Division (HUD-PSD)
            Department of the Interior
            Edit
            Seal of the United States Department of the Interior
            Office of Inspector General (DOI-OIG)
            Bureau of Indian Affairs (BIA)
            Office of Justice Services
            Bureau of Indian Affairs Police
            Bureau of Land Management (BLM)
            Office of Law Enforcement
            United States Bureau of Reclamation (BOR)
            Security Response Force (SRF) formerly known as (Hoover Dam Police), that covers Hoover Dam, Grand Coulee Dam and Glen Canyon Dam
            National Park Service (NPS)
            U.S. Park Ranger
            United States Park Police
            Office of Surface Mining Reclamation and Enforcement (OSMRE)
            United States Fish and Wildlife Service (USFWS)
            Office of Law Enforcement (FWS OLE)
            Division of Refuge Law Enforcement
            Department of Justice
            Edit
            Seal of the United States Department of Justice
            Office of the Inspector General (DOJ-OIG)
            Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF)
            Drug Enforcement Administration (DEA)
            Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI)
            FBI Police
            FBI Academy
            Federal Bureau of Prisons (BOP)
            United States Marshals Service (USMS)
            Office of Professional Responsibility (DOJ OPR)
            Department of Labor
            Edit
            Seal of the United States Department of Labor
            Office of Inspector General (DOL-OIG)
            Department of State
            Edit
            U.S. Department of State official seal
            Office of Inspector General (DOS-OIG)
            Bureau of Diplomatic Security (DS)
            Diplomatic Security Service (DSS)
            Department of Transportation
            Edit
            Seal of the United States Department of Transportation
            Office of Inspector General (DOT-OIG)
            United States Merchant Marine Academy
            Department of Public Safety (USMMADPS)
            National Highway Traffic Safety Administration
            Office of Odometer Fraud Investigation (OFI)
            Department of the Treasury
            Edit
            Seal of the United States Department of the Treasury

            A Bureau of Engraving and Printing Police (BEP) patrol car.
            Office of Inspector General (USDT-OIG)
            Bureau of Engraving and Printing
            Bureau of Engraving and Printing Police
            Financial Crimes Enforcement Network (FINCEN)
            Internal Revenue Service (IRS)
            Criminal Investigation (IRS-CI)
            United States Mint Police (USMP)
            Treasury Inspector General for Tax Administration (TIGTA)
            Special Inspector General for Pandemic Recovery (SIGPR)[9]
            Special Inspector General for the Troubled Asset Relief Program (SIGTARP)

            Two IRS-CI Special Agents conducting a search
            Department of Veterans Affairs
            Edit
            Seal of the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs
            Office of Inspector General (VA-OIG)
            Veterans Affairs Police

            "You never know what worse luck your bad luck has saved you from."
            -Cormac McCarthy

            1 Reply Last reply
            • jon-nycJ Offline
              jon-nycJ Offline
              jon-nyc
              wrote on last edited by
              #10

              73 federal agencies have full time armed security forces.

              https://www.thoughtco.com/firearms-and-arrest-authority-federal-agencies-3321279

              "You never know what worse luck your bad luck has saved you from."
              -Cormac McCarthy

              1 Reply Last reply
              • JollyJ Offline
                JollyJ Offline
                Jolly
                wrote on last edited by Jolly
                #11

                We need 73 agencies with armed agents?

                Makes no sense to me.

                Military? Well, duh.
                Interior? Sure, wildlife agents.
                Treasury? That's Secret Service, etc.
                Justice? Another duh.
                But the IRS? Agriculture? Transportation? Labor? Etc.?

                “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                IvorythumperI 1 Reply Last reply
                • jon-nycJ Offline
                  jon-nycJ Offline
                  jon-nyc
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #12

                  I hear you. It seems absurd

                  "You never know what worse luck your bad luck has saved you from."
                  -Cormac McCarthy

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  • JollyJ Jolly

                    We need 73 agencies with armed agents?

                    Makes no sense to me.

                    Military? Well, duh.
                    Interior? Sure, wildlife agents.
                    Treasury? That's Secret Service, etc.
                    Justice? Another duh.
                    But the IRS? Agriculture? Transportation? Labor? Etc.?

                    IvorythumperI Offline
                    IvorythumperI Offline
                    Ivorythumper
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #13

                    @Jolly said in Maybe they decided to use nondeadly force. Or is that undeadly force? I'm confused.:

                    We need 73 agencies with armed agents?

                    Makes no sense to me.

                    Military? Well, duh.
                    Interior? Sure, wildlife agents.
                    Treasury? That's Secret Service, etc.
                    Justice? Another duh.
                    But the IRS? Agriculture? Transportation? Labor? Etc.?

                    AG needs to carry because Forest Service as well as a lot of criminal activity in the food supply chain for restaurants....

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • jon-nycJ Offline
                      jon-nycJ Offline
                      jon-nyc
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #14

                      My guess is that the enabling legislation for each of these agencies allowed for enforcement so they went ahead and built it internally.

                      "You never know what worse luck your bad luck has saved you from."
                      -Cormac McCarthy

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