Today's musical interlude
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I was only joking
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@larry said in Today's musical interlude:
@klaus said in Today's musical interlude:
OK, Larry, tell me: When is a piece of music "classical music"? Why did you call this song "classical music"?
Why do you say it is not ?
Because in my opinion the word "classical music" refers to music that stands in the tradition or is an evolution of Western art music. I don't hear much of that in the piece, but I hear a lot that stands in the tradition of Western pop and rock music.
Of course "classical music" can be composed today, and there are is no shortage of composers. It's just that I wouldn't apply the label to this particular piece, for the reason given above.
Now it's your turn.
@klaus said in Today's musical interlude:
@larry said in Today's musical interlude:
@klaus said in Today's musical interlude:
OK, Larry, tell me: When is a piece of music "classical music"? Why did you call this song "classical music"?
Why do you say it is not ?
Because in my opinion the word "classical music" refers to music that stands in the tradition or is an evolution of Western art music. I don't hear much of that in the piece, but I hear a lot that stands in the tradition of Western pop and rock music.
Of course "classical music" can be composed today, and there are is no shortage of composers. It's just that I wouldn't apply the label to this particular piece, for the reason given above.
Now it's your turn.
"Stands in the tradition or is an evolution of western art music"...... so you admit that music evolves..., but we have two paths here.... 1. "In the tradition of" or 2. "Evolves from" western art music.... the piano and the various composers who wrote for it and performed on it, "stood in the tradition of western art music", and "Evolves from it". That tradition had been in place for a LONG time before the invention of the piano. Most of the pianists from that era were the "pop stars" of their day, looked down on by musical elitist who viewed the piano as vulgar. Liszt as an example, was the equivalent of the Beatles during his day. So to talk about something being "in the tradition of r an evolution of" western art music is a ridiculous statement, unless you believe "western art music" stopped evolving at some point, or Montreal is not in the West....
Blue grass is a part of the evolution of western art music also. Unless you're now going to try to claim that only 300 year old pianists created art, which opens up a whole other can of stupid.
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@george-k said in Today's musical interlude:
@Larry , what is YOUR definition of "classical" music?
Classical music is what people who would drown if it rained on them listen to because other people who would drown if it rained on them told them it made them look sophisticated if they listen to it.
Classical music began 200 years before the existence of the modern piano, and continues to be written to this very day.
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@doctor-phibes said in Today's musical interlude:
@mik said in Today's musical interlude:
Also the Russians.
All of them?
Nyet, nekulturny.
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I like classical musical, but I'm a jazz snob
I wouldn't really have described that second piece as 'classical', more classical-influenced.
Does it really matter? We stick labels on things to try and help categorize them. Then the label becomes more important than the music......
I was only joking
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@george-k said in Today's musical interlude:
@Larry , what is YOUR definition of "classical" music?
Classical music is what people who would drown if it rained on them listen to because other people who would drown if it rained on them told them it made them look sophisticated if they listen to it.
Classical music began 200 years before the existence of the modern piano, and continues to be written to this very day.
@larry said in Today's musical interlude:
Classical music is what people who would drown if it rained on them listen to because other people who would drown if it rained on them told them it made them look sophisticated if they listen to it.
That's a pretty non-responsive answer.
Classical music began 200 years before the existence of the modern piano, and continues to be written to this very day.
That's true, but doesn't define it.
How about this?
"Classical Music is something @Larry hates?"
(among other things, of course)
"Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08
The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.
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I like classical musical, but I'm a jazz snob
I wouldn't really have described that second piece as 'classical', more classical-influenced.
Does it really matter? We stick labels on things to try and help categorize them. Then the label becomes more important than the music......
@doctor-phibes said in Today's musical interlude:
I like classical musical, but I'm a jazz snob
I wouldn't really have described that second piece as 'classical', more classical-influenced.
Does it really matter? We stick labels on things to try and help categorize them. Then the label becomes more important than the music......
I want to like it. But I can't because I simply cannot tolerate the elitism itsadherents tend to display. I absolutely despise pretentiousness, and that has climbed all over the genre like ugly on an ape.
And like you say, the label is more important to them than the music.
So.... fuck Chopin...... lol
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@larry said in Today's musical interlude:
Classical music is what people who would drown if it rained on them listen to because other people who would drown if it rained on them told them it made them look sophisticated if they listen to it.
That's a pretty non-responsive answer.
Classical music began 200 years before the existence of the modern piano, and continues to be written to this very day.
That's true, but doesn't define it.
How about this?
"Classical Music is something @Larry hates?"
(among other things, of course)
@george-k said in Today's musical interlude:
@larry said in Today's musical interlude:
Classical music is what people who would drown if it rained on them listen to because other people who would drown if it rained on them told them it made them look sophisticated if they listen to it.
That's a pretty non-responsive answer.
Classical music began 200 years before the existence of the modern piano, and continues to be written to this very day.
That's true, but doesn't define it.
How about this?
"Classical Music is something @Larry hates?"
(among other things, of course)
I thought it was quite responsive, and to the point, myself....
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@doctor-phibes said in Today's musical interlude:
I like classical musical, but I'm a jazz snob
I wouldn't really have described that second piece as 'classical', more classical-influenced.
Does it really matter? We stick labels on things to try and help categorize them. Then the label becomes more important than the music......
I want to like it. But I can't because I simply cannot tolerate the elitism itsadherents tend to display. I absolutely despise pretentiousness, and that has climbed all over the genre like ugly on an ape.
And like you say, the label is more important to them than the music.
So.... fuck Chopin...... lol
@larry said in Today's musical interlude:
I simply cannot tolerate the elitism itsadherents tend to display.
IOW, you can't distinguish the art from the person who either produces it or likes it, right?
Would you say the same thing, say, about "country" music (whatever that is these days)?
"I hate country music because the people who like it are a bunch of knuckle-dragging rednecks."
That's, basically, what you're saying, isn't it?
"Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08
The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.
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Klaus, to be honest, you are displaying the very snobbery that made me hate classical music to start with. What a narrow minded view of things you have... sheesh
@larry said in Today's musical interlude:
Klaus, to be honest, you are displaying the very snobbery that made me hate classical music to start with. What a narrow minded view of things you have... sheesh
My definition is more or less what you'd find in dictionaries. It's not my invention. Words are not very useful when they don't have meaning. I've given you what I think most people mean when they use the word.
So, let me ask you again. You listen to a piece of music. How do you decide whether it's "classical music"? You still haven't given an answer.
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@larry said in Today's musical interlude:
I simply cannot tolerate the elitism itsadherents tend to display.
IOW, you can't distinguish the art from the person who either produces it or likes it, right?
Would you say the same thing, say, about "country" music (whatever that is these days)?
"I hate country music because the people who like it are a bunch of knuckle-dragging rednecks."
That's, basically, what you're saying, isn't it?
@george-k said in Today's musical interlude:
@larry said in Today's musical interlude:
I simply cannot tolerate the elitism itsadherents tend to display.
IOW, you can't distinguish the art from the person who either produces it or likes it, right?
Would you say the same thing, say, about "country" music (whatever that is these days)?
"I hate country music because the people who like it are a bunch of knuckle-dragging rednecks."
That's, basically, what you're saying, isn't it?
Not at all.
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@george-k said in Today's musical interlude:
@larry said in Today's musical interlude:
I simply cannot tolerate the elitism itsadherents tend to display.
IOW, you can't distinguish the art from the person who either produces it or likes it, right?
Would you say the same thing, say, about "country" music (whatever that is these days)?
"I hate country music because the people who like it are a bunch of knuckle-dragging rednecks."
That's, basically, what you're saying, isn't it?
Not at all.
@larry said in Today's musical interlude:
Not at all.
That's exactly what you said. You said your hatred of the music developed from the snobby, elitist attitudes of the people who tried to teach it to you or who enjoy it.
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@larry said in Today's musical interlude:
Not at all.
That's exactly what you said. You said your hatred of the music developed from the snobby, elitist attitudes of the people who tried to teach it to you or who enjoy it.
@george-k said in Today's musical interlude:
@larry said in Today's musical interlude:
Not at all.
That's exactly what you said. You said your hatred of the music developed from the snobby, elitist attitudes of the people who tried to teach it to you or who enjoy it.
I said I wanted to like classical music, but couldn't because of the snobbery that's associated with it. 8n other words, I COULD enjoy the music if it weren't for the snobbery of most (not all, George) of the people who are snobs. You know - the ones that routinely DO look down their noses at country music, pop music, etc. And constantly remind you that it is inferior "folk music" - you know... "redneck music"...
You're trying to accuse me of the very thing classical music snobs do all the time, George. I have AKWAYS made it clear that it's not the music I hate, but the attitude that goes along with it.
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I like classical musical, but I'm a jazz snob
I wouldn't really have described that second piece as 'classical', more classical-influenced.
Does it really matter? We stick labels on things to try and help categorize them. Then the label becomes more important than the music......
@doctor-phibes said in Today's musical interlude:
I wouldn't really have described that second piece as 'classical', more classical-influenced.
Does it really matter? We stick labels on things to try and help categorize them. Then the label becomes more important than the music......
Just listen to the Beatles from Rubber Soul right up to the break up of the band. George Martin’s classical music training and influence is more than obvious.
Then there are other bands like Deep Purple,Yes and Emerson, Lake & Palmer just to name a few. Classical music formed the very foundation of their style of rock music. Deep Purple’s Jon Lord plays a descending keyboard break in Highway Star that is a variation of a passage from Bach Partita.
So it doesn’t matter - great musicianship is great musicianship regardless of style or genre or, whether or not you went to music school. People forget that Liszt was, for the most part, self taught in both piano technique and composition. Sure he took a couple of private lessons but he, unlike Chopin, never attended a Conservatory.
Elbows up!
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Just go back through this thread and you'll see what I'm talking about.
I made it clear that it wasn't the music but the snobbery that I didn't like. To prove my point, I posted a link to a modern classical piece that I like. Right out of the gate I was informed that it wasn't "ckassical", didn't even qualify as classical, and sounded like pop music using "classical orchestra instruments. Let me translate that for you:
"Your music is inferior folk music faking it with instruments YOUR music isn't supposed to use.
IE.... you like redneck music.
Next I'm informed that no modern music can be classical, which was quickly shown to be a silly claim.
Now I'm being ragged over shit I didn't even say, all because I dared to say anything about the fucking snobbery associated with what by and large consists of (as it related to piano) exercises designed to teach harpichordists how to adjust to sustain both from let off as well as a sustain pedal, à and church music.
