Pandemic of the vaccinated?
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@george-k said in Pandemic of the vaccinated?:
@jon-nyc said in Pandemic of the vaccinated?:
narratives need to be served
Indeed. There are narratives to suit whomever.
After all, the narrative we were told back in the spring/summer was that vaccination will prevent you from getting infected, because "science."
And now, the "science" has changed, and so has the narrative.
Yeah, I'm also getting sick of "the science says" arguments, especially when they are wrong.
Just like in climate change, both scientists and the media should be much more careful in how they present the state of the science and say "we don't know, really" much more often. Also, it's a good time to remember Hume's insight that science is about the "is" and not about the "ought" - the latter is the domain of politics and when scientists talk about "ought" they become politicians.
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@klaus and how many political figures and talking heads told us, on television and social media (Yeah, Rachel Maddow, you!) that vaccination will stop the spread and "you can't get it" if you're vaccinated.
And that kind of misinformation still is all over social media.
And, as I've said many times before, I'm no anti-vaxxer to be sure (triple-dosed here), but c'mon. Stop with the hyperbole.
@Klaus , it's been many decades since I read Hume. That's a great statement from him.
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I don’t think the science changed. The virus did.
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@george-k said in Pandemic of the vaccinated?:
@jon-nyc said in Pandemic of the vaccinated?:
narratives need to be served
Indeed. There are narratives to suit whomever.
After all, the narrative we were told back in the spring/summer was that vaccination will prevent you from getting infected, because "science."
And now, the "science" has changed, and so has the narrative.
That may have been the message in the US, but not up here, at least at the national level. The message from Ottawa and the various national media outlets, was that the vaccine would lessen the likelihood of hospitalization and severe outcomes in the event of infection. It stressed there were no guarantees the vaccine(s) would prevent infections although it would probably help prevent spread in the community. Still it was vital to have as many people as possible vaccinated.
At the provincial levels it was entirely other narratives. Some were cavalier. For example the moronic toads governing this province went as far as to proclaim the pandemic over and done as 1 July - only to have Delta bite their sorry political asses off in September. Other provinces were more cautious in their narratives.
‘a-blowe yow and be-kele yow wel, and comyth up all with your ease’ ~ attributed to Henry V
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“I am fond of pigs. Dogs look up to us. Cats look down on us. Pigs treat us as equals.” ~Winston S. Churchill
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@renauda said in Pandemic of the vaccinated?:
It stressed there were no guarantees the vaccine(s) would prevent infections although it would probably help prevent spread in the community.
That there were no guarantees was stressed
And simultaneously the guarantees were stressed
Either fact could be confirmed by saying "Mr. Trump".
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‘a-blowe yow and be-kele yow wel, and comyth up all with your ease’ ~ attributed to Henry V
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I do not know what Trump has to do with the messaging around C19 vaccines in Canada or outside the USA. If you care to make that connection for me, there may be a chance I will be able to make sense of your post.
In the meantime however, I will not hold my breath for a coherent explanation. I doubt such exists.
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@jon-nyc said in Pandemic of the vaccinated?:
If everyone is vaccinated then 100% of the cases will be breakthrough cases. This is not a measure of vaccine efficacy like the anti-vaxxers want you to believe.
That would be an effective argument if there weren’t 1) a significantly large cohort of unvaxxed (there is) and 2) the overall number of cases were reducing (they aren’t).
Initially there was a push on the vaccines preventing spread in official pressers then they shifted to effectiveness against severe COVID. However, the entire push for vaccine mandates has been about preventing spread and that unvaxxed individuals are a danger to their Aunt Agnes and everyone around them.
The Brad
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@lufins-dad said in Pandemic of the vaccinated?:
@jon-nyc said in Pandemic of the vaccinated?:
If everyone is vaccinated then 100% of the cases will be breakthrough cases. This is not a measure of vaccine efficacy like the anti-vaxxers want you to believe.
That would be an effective argument if there weren’t 1) a significantly large cohort of unvaxxed (there is) and 2) the overall number of cases were reducing (they aren’t).
Initially there was a push on the vaccines preventing spread in official pressers then they shifted to effectiveness against severe COVID.
They "changed their minds" about this because variants initially were not very effective in causing breakthrough cases. Then they were, and very much so.
The pandemic keeps changing. That's why the recommended practices do.
And then there are the policy assholes who now have to develop rules for not only the biggest change in our day-to-day in living history, but one that didn't exist two years ago.
There are going to be many policy screw-ups. Very few of these people are rubbing their hands together, laughing to themselves in their basements. Most of them are just incompetent.
Please love yourself.
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@aqua-letifer said in Pandemic of the vaccinated?:
Very few of these people are rubbing their hands together, laughing to themselves in their basements. Most of them are just incompetent.
Yes? I've never said that these people are maniacal geniuses with evil plots. I think most of them are well-intentioned incompetents. That doesn't make their decisions any less damaging.
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@mik said in Pandemic of the vaccinated?:
Yep. What I have always heard is it won't necessarily prevent infection but reduces the chance of severe disease.
This was always the message I have been hearing, even from the beginning before vaccines.
It was always "flatten the curve", keep hospitals from overwhelming, etc.
