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The New Coffee Room

  1. TNCR
  2. General Discussion
  3. Study: A third of those who got COVID-19 did not generate antibodies

Study: A third of those who got COVID-19 did not generate antibodies

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  • brendaB Offline
    brendaB Offline
    brenda
    wrote on last edited by
    #1

    NewsMD
    CORONAVIRUS
    Study: A third of those who got COVID-19 did not generate antibodies
    Findings reinforce that vaccination is needed, suggest vaccine effectiveness data could be affected.
    Written By: Paul John Scott | 10:33 am, Sep. 9, 2021

    ROCHESTER, Minn. — Here's another reason to get vaccinated for COVID-19: New data suggests that having previously caught the virus is no guarantee you ever developed antibodies to defend against a future infection.

    The latest news that not everyone who gets COVID-19 develops antibodies is first and foremost an argument for getting vaccinated, as getting the shot offers another opportunity to teach your body to recognize the virus.

    Researchers cautioned that "persons who experienced COVID-19 symptoms might be less inclined to seek vaccination, believing they are protected," when "our results caution against this assumption."

    The findings also offer an argument, however, that methods of studying the vaccines could have mismeasured their effectiveness by having missed some vaccinated persons who caught breakthrough infections but developed no antibodies to show for it.

    "The fact that a considerable fraction of (COVID-19) positive persons fail to seroconvert (or develop antibodies) has practical implications," the authors explained.

    "Such persons remain undetected in seroprevalence studies, including in vaccine studies that assess protection from asymptomatic infection by measuring antibodies..."

    Those are some of the takeaways from a new study examining the mysterious relationship between testing positive for COVID-19 and developing antibodies for coronavirus.

    Researchers from the University of Pennsylvania and elsewhere published the paper in the September issue of the journal Emerging Infectious Disease, published by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

    After waiting for three weeks of no symptoms following diagnosis, the researchers took blood samples from 72 patients who had been diagnosed with COVID-19 and recovered.

    Upon checking for antibodies to the spike protein, they learned that 26 of the 72 who clearly had gotten COVID-19 had no such antibodies. The authors stated these results indicated 36% of those studied did not develop antibodies to COVID-19.

    It adds to a broad array of findings seeking to quantify how many people do not get antibodies after getting COVID-19, with some studies showing only a few patients who fail at so-called seroconversion, while others find that percentage to be high.

    In the Pennsylvania study, neither the presence of symptoms, severity of illness, race, ethnicity or gender predicted those who were less likely to develop antibodies.

    The only variables predictive of not getting antibodies were being younger, and having taken a COVID-19 test requiring higher sensitivity prior to diagnosis.

    "It's a little difficult to know what to make of it," cautions Mayo Clinic vaccination expert Dr. Greg Poland. "It's a small study."

    Citing "studies showing nonseroconversion from anywhere 5% to 80%," Poland says "these are studies are confounded by variables we may not understand or acknowledge."

    The authors countered that earlier studies of the question were confounded in ways theirs was not. They asserted their findings "provide an explanation for the puzzling variability of seroconversion in different cohorts."

    Still others have taken from the findings that any policy makers who propose herd immunity through infection are on shaky ground, given that a third of the infected may never get antibodies.

    "Can nonseroconversion occur?" asks Poland. "Absolutely ... it particularly makes sense if somebody had very mild or asymptomatic infection."

    As for what this all means to those who already had COVID-19, the official recommendation is for two doses of vaccine 90 days after recovery from infection, Poland says, adding that "the data show that perhaps only one dose is necessary."

    But people who were previously infected "have a 2.3-fold increased risk of breakthrough infection," he adds, "compared to people previously infected who got at least one dose of vaccine."

    On top of all this, the latest variants change the rules of protection as well.

    "The variant you were exposed to and infected with a year ago," Poland says, "is almost like a different virus than the one circulating today."

    L CopperC 2 Replies Last reply
    • brendaB brenda

      NewsMD
      CORONAVIRUS
      Study: A third of those who got COVID-19 did not generate antibodies
      Findings reinforce that vaccination is needed, suggest vaccine effectiveness data could be affected.
      Written By: Paul John Scott | 10:33 am, Sep. 9, 2021

      ROCHESTER, Minn. — Here's another reason to get vaccinated for COVID-19: New data suggests that having previously caught the virus is no guarantee you ever developed antibodies to defend against a future infection.

      The latest news that not everyone who gets COVID-19 develops antibodies is first and foremost an argument for getting vaccinated, as getting the shot offers another opportunity to teach your body to recognize the virus.

      Researchers cautioned that "persons who experienced COVID-19 symptoms might be less inclined to seek vaccination, believing they are protected," when "our results caution against this assumption."

      The findings also offer an argument, however, that methods of studying the vaccines could have mismeasured their effectiveness by having missed some vaccinated persons who caught breakthrough infections but developed no antibodies to show for it.

      "The fact that a considerable fraction of (COVID-19) positive persons fail to seroconvert (or develop antibodies) has practical implications," the authors explained.

      "Such persons remain undetected in seroprevalence studies, including in vaccine studies that assess protection from asymptomatic infection by measuring antibodies..."

      Those are some of the takeaways from a new study examining the mysterious relationship between testing positive for COVID-19 and developing antibodies for coronavirus.

      Researchers from the University of Pennsylvania and elsewhere published the paper in the September issue of the journal Emerging Infectious Disease, published by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

      After waiting for three weeks of no symptoms following diagnosis, the researchers took blood samples from 72 patients who had been diagnosed with COVID-19 and recovered.

      Upon checking for antibodies to the spike protein, they learned that 26 of the 72 who clearly had gotten COVID-19 had no such antibodies. The authors stated these results indicated 36% of those studied did not develop antibodies to COVID-19.

      It adds to a broad array of findings seeking to quantify how many people do not get antibodies after getting COVID-19, with some studies showing only a few patients who fail at so-called seroconversion, while others find that percentage to be high.

      In the Pennsylvania study, neither the presence of symptoms, severity of illness, race, ethnicity or gender predicted those who were less likely to develop antibodies.

      The only variables predictive of not getting antibodies were being younger, and having taken a COVID-19 test requiring higher sensitivity prior to diagnosis.

      "It's a little difficult to know what to make of it," cautions Mayo Clinic vaccination expert Dr. Greg Poland. "It's a small study."

      Citing "studies showing nonseroconversion from anywhere 5% to 80%," Poland says "these are studies are confounded by variables we may not understand or acknowledge."

      The authors countered that earlier studies of the question were confounded in ways theirs was not. They asserted their findings "provide an explanation for the puzzling variability of seroconversion in different cohorts."

      Still others have taken from the findings that any policy makers who propose herd immunity through infection are on shaky ground, given that a third of the infected may never get antibodies.

      "Can nonseroconversion occur?" asks Poland. "Absolutely ... it particularly makes sense if somebody had very mild or asymptomatic infection."

      As for what this all means to those who already had COVID-19, the official recommendation is for two doses of vaccine 90 days after recovery from infection, Poland says, adding that "the data show that perhaps only one dose is necessary."

      But people who were previously infected "have a 2.3-fold increased risk of breakthrough infection," he adds, "compared to people previously infected who got at least one dose of vaccine."

      On top of all this, the latest variants change the rules of protection as well.

      "The variant you were exposed to and infected with a year ago," Poland says, "is almost like a different virus than the one circulating today."

      L Offline
      L Offline
      Loki
      wrote on last edited by
      #2

      As a tangent I read and can’t find a study says that the best immunity is conferred by having both had Covid plus vaccination.

      1 Reply Last reply
      • brendaB brenda

        NewsMD
        CORONAVIRUS
        Study: A third of those who got COVID-19 did not generate antibodies
        Findings reinforce that vaccination is needed, suggest vaccine effectiveness data could be affected.
        Written By: Paul John Scott | 10:33 am, Sep. 9, 2021

        ROCHESTER, Minn. — Here's another reason to get vaccinated for COVID-19: New data suggests that having previously caught the virus is no guarantee you ever developed antibodies to defend against a future infection.

        The latest news that not everyone who gets COVID-19 develops antibodies is first and foremost an argument for getting vaccinated, as getting the shot offers another opportunity to teach your body to recognize the virus.

        Researchers cautioned that "persons who experienced COVID-19 symptoms might be less inclined to seek vaccination, believing they are protected," when "our results caution against this assumption."

        The findings also offer an argument, however, that methods of studying the vaccines could have mismeasured their effectiveness by having missed some vaccinated persons who caught breakthrough infections but developed no antibodies to show for it.

        "The fact that a considerable fraction of (COVID-19) positive persons fail to seroconvert (or develop antibodies) has practical implications," the authors explained.

        "Such persons remain undetected in seroprevalence studies, including in vaccine studies that assess protection from asymptomatic infection by measuring antibodies..."

        Those are some of the takeaways from a new study examining the mysterious relationship between testing positive for COVID-19 and developing antibodies for coronavirus.

        Researchers from the University of Pennsylvania and elsewhere published the paper in the September issue of the journal Emerging Infectious Disease, published by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

        After waiting for three weeks of no symptoms following diagnosis, the researchers took blood samples from 72 patients who had been diagnosed with COVID-19 and recovered.

        Upon checking for antibodies to the spike protein, they learned that 26 of the 72 who clearly had gotten COVID-19 had no such antibodies. The authors stated these results indicated 36% of those studied did not develop antibodies to COVID-19.

        It adds to a broad array of findings seeking to quantify how many people do not get antibodies after getting COVID-19, with some studies showing only a few patients who fail at so-called seroconversion, while others find that percentage to be high.

        In the Pennsylvania study, neither the presence of symptoms, severity of illness, race, ethnicity or gender predicted those who were less likely to develop antibodies.

        The only variables predictive of not getting antibodies were being younger, and having taken a COVID-19 test requiring higher sensitivity prior to diagnosis.

        "It's a little difficult to know what to make of it," cautions Mayo Clinic vaccination expert Dr. Greg Poland. "It's a small study."

        Citing "studies showing nonseroconversion from anywhere 5% to 80%," Poland says "these are studies are confounded by variables we may not understand or acknowledge."

        The authors countered that earlier studies of the question were confounded in ways theirs was not. They asserted their findings "provide an explanation for the puzzling variability of seroconversion in different cohorts."

        Still others have taken from the findings that any policy makers who propose herd immunity through infection are on shaky ground, given that a third of the infected may never get antibodies.

        "Can nonseroconversion occur?" asks Poland. "Absolutely ... it particularly makes sense if somebody had very mild or asymptomatic infection."

        As for what this all means to those who already had COVID-19, the official recommendation is for two doses of vaccine 90 days after recovery from infection, Poland says, adding that "the data show that perhaps only one dose is necessary."

        But people who were previously infected "have a 2.3-fold increased risk of breakthrough infection," he adds, "compared to people previously infected who got at least one dose of vaccine."

        On top of all this, the latest variants change the rules of protection as well.

        "The variant you were exposed to and infected with a year ago," Poland says, "is almost like a different virus than the one circulating today."

        CopperC Offline
        CopperC Offline
        Copper
        wrote on last edited by Copper
        #3

        @brenda said in Study: A third of those who got COVID-19 did not generate antibodies:

        The latest news that not everyone who gets COVID-19 develops antibodies

        Then what made it go away? Or did all these people die?

        1 Reply Last reply
        • jon-nycJ Offline
          jon-nycJ Offline
          jon-nyc
          wrote on last edited by
          #4

          Very interesting.

          Only non-witches get due process.

          • Cotton Mather, Salem Massachusetts, 1692
          1 Reply Last reply
          • George KG Offline
            George KG Offline
            George K
            wrote on last edited by
            #5

            Absolutely fascinating. Glad D2 got vaccinated.

            100 years from now, we may understand this virus. We are still flailing.

            "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08

            The saying, "Lite is just one damn thing after another," is a gross understatement. The damn things overlap.

            1 Reply Last reply
            • LuFins DadL Offline
              LuFins DadL Offline
              LuFins Dad
              wrote on last edited by
              #6

              Makes me wish antibody testing was more prevalent.

              The Brad

              1 Reply Last reply
              • LuFins DadL Offline
                LuFins DadL Offline
                LuFins Dad
                wrote on last edited by
                #7

                Wait, the younger the patient the less likely to develop lasting antibodies?

                The Brad

                Aqua LetiferA 1 Reply Last reply
                • LuFins DadL LuFins Dad

                  Wait, the younger the patient the less likely to develop lasting antibodies?

                  Aqua LetiferA Offline
                  Aqua LetiferA Offline
                  Aqua Letifer
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #8

                  @lufins-dad said in Study: A third of those who got COVID-19 did not generate antibodies:

                  Wait, the younger the patient the less likely to develop lasting antibodies?

                  Makes sense to me. They're more likely to be asymptomatic or close to it.

                  Please love yourself.

                  LuFins DadL 1 Reply Last reply
                  • Aqua LetiferA Aqua Letifer

                    @lufins-dad said in Study: A third of those who got COVID-19 did not generate antibodies:

                    Wait, the younger the patient the less likely to develop lasting antibodies?

                    Makes sense to me. They're more likely to be asymptomatic or close to it.

                    LuFins DadL Offline
                    LuFins DadL Offline
                    LuFins Dad
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #9

                    @aqua-letifer said in Study: A third of those who got COVID-19 did not generate antibodies:

                    @lufins-dad said in Study: A third of those who got COVID-19 did not generate antibodies:

                    Wait, the younger the patient the less likely to develop lasting antibodies?

                    Makes sense to me. They're more likely to be asymptomatic or close to it.

                    But according to the report, it had nothing to do with severity of symptoms.

                    The Brad

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    • Aqua LetiferA Offline
                      Aqua LetiferA Offline
                      Aqua Letifer
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #10

                      @lufins-dad said in Study: A third of those who got COVID-19 did not generate antibodies:

                      But according to the report, it had nothing to do with severity of symptoms.

                      huh. Well, shit.

                      Please love yourself.

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      • JollyJ Offline
                        JollyJ Offline
                        Jolly
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #11

                        Wasn't there a study in Israel that found more antibodies from infection than from vaccination?

                        “Cry havoc and let slip the DOGE of war!”

                        Those who cheered as J-6 American prisoners were locked in solitary for 18 months without trial, now suddenly fight tooth and nail for foreign terrorists’ "due process". — Buck Sexton

                        LuFins DadL 1 Reply Last reply
                        • JollyJ Jolly

                          Wasn't there a study in Israel that found more antibodies from infection than from vaccination?

                          LuFins DadL Offline
                          LuFins DadL Offline
                          LuFins Dad
                          wrote on last edited by LuFins Dad
                          #12

                          @jolly yep. https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.24.21262415v1

                          The Brad

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